Forums | MacLife

Yes, I certainly should have been aborted.  But now I'm here and you're all gonna pay.

Alien wrote:

jkahless wrote:

matt wrote:

I weigh that against a lifetime of being raised either with parents who didn't want you, in foster homes, or in poverty, and it seems probable that abortion is frequently the option that inflicts less suffering.

And what weight does that carry?  With that logic, there's quite a few million grown people walking around that you should probably kill as well.  They'd probably have something to say about it.

Yeah, well, I do believe you are kind of missing the point entirely.

Perhaps willingly.

,xtG
.tsooJ

Not too sure how I'm missing the point.  Yeah, abortion might lead to less suffering, but that isn't how things work in life.  People suffer, and that's part of life, part of humanity.  There is no valid point to be made.

I suppose when it comes to moral issues, I've always played it safe.  I've always believed that we have no right to take a human life against their will, except in the defense of those we love.  Convenience, timing, want, none of those things play into the equation.

robco wrote:

There are many who feel that reproductive freedom is in fact, a basic human right...

reproductive freedom is thinking about the consequences of unprotected sex before having sex - not deciding later on you don't want to be responsible for the consequences of your own actions.

one could argue that a basic human right is not being killed before having a chance to live.

funny how conservatives want to protect the innocent, and kill the guilty.  while the liberals want to kill the innocent, and protect the guilty.

let me go on the record saying that i don't care if you get an abortion or not.  that's your conscious.  i definitely don't think it should receive a dime of tax payer money, however.

NokX wrote:

reproductive freedom is thinking about the consequences of unprotected sex before having sex - not deciding later on you don't want to be responsible for the consequences of your own actions.

And if unprotected sex is not a choice one can make?

NokX wrote:

reproductive freedom is thinking about the consequences of unprotected sex before having sex - not deciding later on you don't want to be responsible for the consequences of your own actions.

Oh, how I wish I could live in the same black & white world that you live in!

NokX wrote:

reproductive freedom is thinking about the consequences of unprotected sex before having sex - not deciding later on you don't want to be responsible for the consequences of your own actions.

Note that they support abortion for things like oh, rape. But you're right, it's the woman's fault she allowed herself to get raped, especially if she lives in a country where legally, she's little more than property.

one could argue that a basic human right is not being killed before having a chance to live.

Or that a basic human right is being able to make decisions regarding one's own health and well-being. We could go 'round and 'round on this one all day. In the end, you either decide that the rights of the fetus trump the rights of the woman, or that the right of the woman trumps the fetus.

funny how conservatives want to protect the innocent, and kill the guilty.  while the liberals want to kill the innocent, and protect the guilty.

No, it's funny that liberals want to give people the personal freedom and liberty to make these difficult moral decisions on their own, something conservatives used to be for.

let me go on the record saying that i don't care if you get an abortion or not.  that's your conscious.  i definitely don't think it should receive a dime of tax payer money, however.

We're not talking about the US here.

Do I also get to withhold my taxpayer dollars if they fund things with which I don't agree? I'm against the death penalty, so I want a refund from the state of CA for the new death chamber they're building up in San Quentin. I'm against government funding of faith-based initiatives, so I want a refund for that too. Oh, and I don't want to pay medical costs for obese people. Or...

NokX wrote:

robco wrote:

There are many who feel that reproductive freedom is in fact, a basic human right...

reproductive freedom is thinking about the consequences of unprotected sex before having sex - not deciding later on you don't want to be responsible for the consequences of your own actions.

Do you have any idea how much rape occurs in conflict zones in Africa ?

robco wrote:

Note that they support abortion for things like oh, rape. But you're right, it's the woman's fault she allowed herself to get raped, especially if she lives in a country where legally, she's little more than property.

...starts thinking about asset forfeiture as an alternative to imprisonment....

Rape is an incredibly violent act. It's very traumatizing. Many feel that victims of rape should not be forced to carry the child of their rapist to full term and as such, rape is an acceptable circumstance under which abortion should be allowed. Otherwise, the mental health and well-being of the woman is at risk.

NokX wrote:

let me go on the record saying that i don't care if you get an abortion or not.  that's your conscious.  i definitely don't think it should receive a dime of tax payer money, however.

...which goes back to my poverty argument.

If you don't fund abortions, and you don't fund welfare, one end result will be an increase in poverty.

robco wrote:

Becoming a "culture of life" only extends to fetuses. Once they're out of the womb, it's another crackwhore's baby and a drain on society. Or that seems to be the mindset.

Nope - the right to life community is directly involved in far more social welfare programs than the pro choice community is.

Wouldn't want the gubmint helping out. Let them find Jeebus and get help from faith-based organizations (who now suckle from the gubmint teat as well).

Compassionate conservatism and all that.

I think you are being extremely dishonest with that characterization - and I think you know it too.

If you have spend any time at these faith based organizations - you'd know that participation in the religious aspects are not required to receive the services. Those who want to can - but they are not required to.

D'Eyncourt wrote:

But my previous post points out that there has been NO notable change in Amnesty International's position on abortion, only that a Cardinal of the Roman Catholic Church has called for his fellow Catholics to withhold their support for AI because of AI's stance on abortion. It's the NewsMax article which falsely states that there has been a change in AI's policy.

I did spend a little time at www.archive.org looking at an archived version of Amnesty's site from 2004, and I couldn't find any comment on abortion, whereas the current site does comment on abortion.

Last edited by mackerm (2007-08-22 5:35 pm)