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Mr. T wrote:

Czachorski wrote:

Mr T - I will fully admit that most of my views come from my own use and discussion with those who have similar needs as me: family, friends and coworkers.  My contention is not that these represent the needs of everyone.  Just that they represent a lot more of a mainstream need than the one you profess, which is highly slanted to the view of a geeky IT person.

It's not like most of my friends are in CS.   I'm a geek, tho.  I will say though, that you're very likely in a later stage of life than I am, so there might be some justification for your sample being significantly different than mine - could just be a different demographic.  In any case, it's not worth arguing about.

I am likely in a later stage of life than you as well. Since I teach CS I am more than familiar with the type of people with which you hang out but I am also able to differentiate that sample group from the computer buying public at large. 20 years ago the CS people were a much larger percentage but these days with computers being as ubiquitous as they are they represent a much smaller percentage of all users.

Mr. T wrote:

frankly wrote:

I am likely in a later stage of life than you as well. Since I teach CS I am more than familiar with the type of people with which you hang out but I am also able to differentiate that sample group from the computer buying public at large.

Most of my friends/family/etc are obviously not in CS, so naturally, it's easy for me to differentiate as well.  I was referring primarily to age/regional/income (ie "demographic") differences.

Anyway, what do you teach, in particular?

I teach in both the CS and IT departments. Here are a few of the courses I teach:

Intro to Programming Principles with Java
Client/Server Systems
Data Comm
Computer Ethics & Security
Programming in Visual Basic
Fundamentals of Information Technology

Frank

Mr. T wrote:

Cool, I learned something new about you.  I figured you must be older than me when I saw that joke in your sig

The best part of that is when people look confused and say it doesn't make sense. You just smile and say no, you're in the those who don't category

I never doubted that switchers who buy iMacs are happy with them; otherwise they never would've switched.  I was just noting that my observations in PC forums have been the exact opposite.  Big picture: hardware-aside, I just don't think most PC users are enthusiastic enough about an OS to consider anything other than Windows.  In other words, Windows and Mac will never "trade places," IMHO.  That's just another gut feeling, mind you...

Personally, I'm not frustrated at all; I love my hackintosh.  I can run OS X as primary and Windows for games.  This weekend, I plan on picking up an 8800GT.  For $200, I'm getting more graphical bliss than a PS3 (fully OS X compatible).  Along with graphics, I'm also getting full h.264 support in hardware, so when I get my Blu Ray drive (later this year) I won't have any trouble with dropped frames in 40mbps movies (I have a 10080p projector).  This technology can neither be added to nor purchased with an iMac, and an adequately configured Mac Pro would've added an extra $2,000 worth of unutilized hardware.  Momentarily taking OSx86 off the table, I'd have switched to Windows if confronted with that dilemma.  These are just my personal needs (not reflective of the industry, or anything like that).

But anyway, as long as we're all happy... that's really all that matters.

Mr. T wrote:

..Along with graphics, I'm also getting full h.264 support in hardware, so when I get my Blu Ray drive (later this year) I won't have any trouble with dropped frames in 40mbps movies (I have a 10080p projector).  This technology can neither be added to nor purchased with an iMac.

Say what? The iMacs still ship with HD 2400XTs and HD 2600 Pros, both of which have the UVD chip. Full hardware accel of both H.264 and VC-1 (tho the display quality is better with the 2600; more shaders for post-processing). Something I'm missing?

Oh, and 10080p... that's some projector.

Edit: link

Last edited by Bat (2008-01-29 6:45 am)

I think Pariah should go use solely windows for a prolonged period of time.    See his attention to details in UI and software, I think he would be tortured very quickly. 

I stopped using it for 99% of my needs just 2.5 yrs ago when I got a Mac at work, and I hope to never have to go back.  I still use it occasionally in Parallels for work, and it pure torture.  Of course, that may be affected by the fact that 2 out of 3 apps I use the most are from MS (Outlook and CRM).  Yuck.

Czachorski wrote:

I think Pariah should go use solely windows for a prolonged period of time.    See his attention to details in UI and software, I think he would be tortured very quickly. 

I stopped using it for 99% of my needs just 2.5 yrs ago when I got a Mac at work, and I hope to never have to go back.  I still use it occasionally in Parallels for work, and it pure torture.  Of course, that may be affected by the fact that 2 out of 3 apps I use the most are from MS (Outlook and CRM).  Yuck.

Yeah, I try to stay away from Windows too. About the only time I use it is when I'm teaching my Client/Server or Programming in Visual Basic courses because we use Visual Studio and SQL Server for those.

Frank

I know. I refer only to the hardware, where ATi was ahead for some time in providing hardware accel of not only H.264, but also VC-1 - less demanding, but still a common HD codec. I think NV may finally have enabled that as well; I'd have to check. Any issue with OSX will be one of software; media player and video drivers have to properly support the hardware. I'm not recommending you an iMac, just mentioning that the hardware is in place.

I'm familiar with your projector; I just don't think it can handle 10080p.

(FWIW, even ATi's $50 card now provides full UVD offload).

frankly wrote:

Czachorski wrote:

I think Pariah should go use solely windows for a prolonged period of time.    See his attention to details in UI and software, I think he would be tortured very quickly. 

I stopped using it for 99% of my needs just 2.5 yrs ago when I got a Mac at work, and I hope to never have to go back.  I still use it occasionally in Parallels for work, and it pure torture.  Of course, that may be affected by the fact that 2 out of 3 apps I use the most are from MS (Outlook and CRM).  Yuck.

Yeah, I try to stay away from Windows too. About the only time I use it is when I'm teaching my Client/Server or Programming in Visual Basic courses because we use Visual Studio and SQL Server for those.

Frank

Perhaps I wasnt clear in my post. The Win2K box I had for almost two years was my only computer during that time. I didnt switch back to a Mac when I had a chance because Windows "sucked" which it does, but just because I like the MacOS better.
Win2K and its decedents are perfectly competent OSs as far as I am concerned and like I said I have never understood what the hell people were doing to their PCs to smurf up Windows as bad as I see people complaining about. But then I am the guy  who never had hardly any of the stability problems with the old MacOS it seemed practically everyone else did.
I have never considered myself any sort of real expert but I can accommodate pretty much any OS you throw at me. Im just the sort who bothers to learn a thing or two about the computer I am using.
Truth be told I am not particularly in love with the GUI of OSX or XP and now Vista. I think both Microsoft and Apple are getting it wrong in pretty significant ways. MS is just tossing in everything and hoping something sticks and Apple can't decide exactly how they want the Finder to work so they keep it a jumbled mess of half spacial, half browser with Coverflow just sorta stapled on, ending up with something that's really just half assed. OSX is still better but it's aimlessness is getting old.
Additionally an increasing number of the apps I like best are open source and cross platform. Truth be told if the developer of GraphicConverter decided to port that to Windows I would jump without hesitation. It's really the only Mac specific program I use that I have never found a great windows replacement for.
The point is I have been becoming pretty agnostic about Os the last few years. I have sorta had to. Apple is clearly set on a course I have no interest in following. The bottom line is I really don't like Steve Jobs' ideas and concepts very well at all. He is the kind of neurotic, obsessed control freak that just climbs up my ass to be blunt.
But the big thing is I am just tired of looking over to the PC side, envying their selection of hardware. At least with PPC there were some cool features and the Apple handicap did not appear to be self inflicted. But the Intel switch changed all that.
Right now Intel is spewing forth a really wonderful stream of desktop CPUs that are both extremely powerful and truly fantastic values and Apple will not use even so much as one single smurfing one of them. By only using either Laptop or Server parts Mac users, remain hamstrung by the platform, only this time it is deliberate gimping instead of just a natural side effect as it was before.
Basically Jobs took most the advantages that going to Intel offered and flushed them right down the toilette.
IN the PPC days we just shrugged, different platform, different hardware, no problem. But now Mac users are just second class citizens in the x86 world. Looking on from the kiddie table, stuck with gimped hardware while the rest of the family gets the whole Intel feast.