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Jdude wrote:

ScifiterX wrote:

And it is easily possible that it interacts with another medicine to cancel each other out or intensify the effect. Out in the field you don't alway have the info to make that call. I'm intimate enough with ER staff members at a couple of hospitals to know what I'm talking about.

Agreed. Use in a hospital as a medical necessity is one thing, but as an assist for an arrest is another.

Metacell wrote:

Farmerkev wrote:

OK, come up with a better and safer option.

Dartgun full of PCP!

Doesn't PCP make people violent and reduce the pain reception?

A. No (although it doesn't necessarily stop them being violent)
B. Yes, however enough PCP will also render a person completely immobile as the body no longer responds to the brains commands.  This is why its used on animals...it just makes the animal too stoned to move, while other tranquilizers often put the actual cardiovascular or respiratory systems at risk (as this one does).  PCP just sends your brain to Pluto.

And...yes, I was probably joking.  Probably.

"Why aren't cops trained properly in Judo/Jujitsu/Aikido or any of the numerous martial arts which provide countless methods of restraining an untrained opponent with no weapons or tools whatsoever."

Just like finding evidence, it would require actual work/physical labor. And judging by the waistlines I've seen around here- that's not a popular activity.

Just wait until they do it to someone's kid who is important and said kid is paralyzed or worse, dies.

Chickenhawk wrote:

mo' ron wrote:

I also doubt the EMTs called in to administer this procedure devised by a doctor are going to choose to use the drug on just any old loon. And considering the sparsity with which this procedure is used, the cops/EMTs apparently know what they're doing enough not to give it to a PCP addict.

From the OP:

There is no research guideline. There is no validated protocol for this. There's not even a clear set of indications for when this is to be used except when people are agitated. By saying that it's done by the emergency medical personnel, they basically are trying to have it both ways. That is, they’re trying to use a medical protocol that is not validated, not for a police function, arrest and detention," Miles said.

If your problem is that there is no bureaucracy behind this procedure, it'd be easy to sit down and write a protocol. That doesn't make this not a valid use of this procedure.

ScifiterX wrote:

An EMT might approach that level of of competence and a cop not so much. While there are good cops, that level of medical expertise is not even in a good cops forte. Add to that, a number of cops are simply of a bully mindset however. They simply have found a publicly acceptable outlet for that sort of behavior. While an EMT may have enough competence to know when administration is inappropriate, they don't always and they are subject to pressure from the cops and political maneuverings.

All this might be true, but there is no evidence this is what happened in this situation (or that this has even been happening, anywhere WRT this procedure), and it doesn't make sense to make potentially good people's jobs less safe, because a lot of people happen to be dumb. If you just assume people are too dumb to be doing a job, nothing would ever get done, in any field.

To solution to corruption isn't to yield to corruption, it's to expect more from people, and encourage them to rise above, not succumb to corrupt pressure.

Chickenhawk wrote:

If somebody is running at cops with weapons, I seriously doubt they'll be subduing them with an injection.

They would just use a different substance for injection. I believe it would be PB + CU at 900-1200 fps with ranged injectors for officer safety.

crazy person wrote:

I have the pow ow ow ow ow ow ower! He ma ow ow man!

I've had this drug before when I went in for a angiogram.  The last thing I remember is commenting that the table was cold when they placed me on it.  The next thing I knew I was in my room.  My sister said she called me and that I answered but didn't make any sense.  And I don't remember a single second of it.

They could have implanted a CIA chip or raped me with a baton and I wouldn't have known.  If under arrest the could have Mirandized and convinced me to make a full confession to something I didn't do and I wouldn't remember thing one when I came to.

Frankly, I don't think the cops should be trusted with this kind of power.

Dan man?

Thanks. I still do not get it.

Wikipedia sez:

Dan Man is the stage name of Belizean entertainer Allison Hemsley. Hemsley, born in Belize City in 1973, is a local musician and composer that has led the return of local rap and dancehall music to Belizean airwaves.

So, do not be a belizean rapper?

Farmerkev wrote:

He's making a snide remark about another poster he can't get along with.

Drop it FJ

ah yes, only mods can make snide remarks about other posters. My bad.

Okay, I've just burned all of my foreign language and theory of music litera...
Aww hell.

Frown on buckaroo.

Get back in your cage!