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Um.. Bren, you should know that a number of the savvier folk hereabouts are not only multiplatform, but savvy enough to get Vista going and even give it 'teh snappy.' Linux isn't exactly a revelation to Booksley et al. Me, I've forgotten more Winders lore than [s]sturner[/s]some folks ever learn.

Bren wrote:

Wrong! Vista won't let you "downgrade" to a previous version of Windows.

Ah.. wrong.

MICROSOFT AND ITS TAME BOX BUILDERS have confirmed that downgrades will be possible from Windows 7, and that some OEMs will even continue to offer XP as a pre-installed option to volume license customers.

We reported yesterday that Hewlett Packard had struck a deal with the software giant, allowing it to offer XP as a downgrade option, but it would seem that the deal is not exclusive to HP as a Microsoft spokesvole confirmed in an email exchange to ZDnet blogger Mary Jo Foley:

"Downgrade rights policies are the same for all of our main OEM partners and what you are talking about is not a special arrangement. Since the End User right to Windows XP Professional is part of the license terms for these editions, it’s really about making facilitation options easier for our OEM customers and End Users."

An HP spokesman also confirmed that download agreements were consistent across all OEMs but declined to provide further details.

Microsoft confirms Windows 7 downgrade policy

I didn't have the same luck with the Sound Blaster card. Although Ubuntu comes with a bunch of Sound Blaster drivers built-in, I couldn't get it to work after a few minutes of fiddling, so I just plugged my speakers into the motherboard's built-in audio port. I'm sure I could have gotten it working if I'd taken the time to post a query on an Ubuntu-user's message board, but I wound up giving the computer to a good friend whose older XP box was running slow and acting buggy.

A good opportunity to metion that Vista lacks the HAL to get full use of sound cards, so you need to download the Creative software that translates Directsound calls to OpenAL.

Had I given her the PC with XP installed, I'm sure she would have found herself back in the same boat in a few months, when Windows managed to muck itself up again, and she would have been no better off.

Perhaps. Have I mentioned I'm typing this from a copy of XP installed in June of '04? Aging hardware, lack of drive space and wanting to get back to modern gaming make a new build or 3 pressing matters, tho. HWare and software is hazzed; time has been lacking.

If your poor, suffering Windows-using friends are tired of malware, endless bugs, slow performance, and Microsoft's increasingly Draconian anti-piracy measures, not to mention Vista's absurd hardware requirements, do them a huge favor, go to ubuntu.com, and download a copy for them!

We're hip. Then again, we might able to even get Vista working for you.


...nah. Your brain would prolly asplode first.

Bat, you wound me to the quick!





I resemble that remark. What I lack in detailed intimate knowledge of Windows, I make up for in vitrolic pessimism borne of long association.

I must be weird. I found XP completely hopeless but switching to Vista turned my PC from a doorstop into a fully functional infotainment system. Mail, Web, PVR, stereo, DTP, whatever, etc, Vista handles it all, sometimes all at once. With XP I felt lucky if I only got 2-3 BSODs per day and to get that level of reliability I had to use the system strictly as a single purpose PVR, nothing else.

As for Ubuntu, I've tried it and it is painless to install and provides a good, solid out of the box user experience. I find it too restrictive though. I'm sure it is possible to configure Ubuntu to recognize exotic hardware like USB mice or to display any monitor resolution other than 1024x768@75 Hz but I've never found a way.

I for one am waiting for W7. Even though I sprang for a second license of XP, I think that the upgrade to W7 would be worth it for my purposes. And I only use Windows on VM or under BootCamp for specific programs. Boot Camp to play games, and VM for work.

Bren, how dare you try to hijack your thread back on topic!

I think that the version/instance of Ubuntu makes a difference. I've had problems even installing a couple of Ubuntu images, so perhaps you that could influence how it performs for some people.

Bren wrote:

All that stuff about Microsoft "allowing" folks to "downgrade" to an OS that actually works doesn't address the fact that Vista itself would not permit me to do so. I never even had the option of selecting the Windows XP disk as the boot drive.

Was the BIOS set to boot from the optical drive first, or another- like the HDD Vista was on?

The BIOS runs things until it hands over to the OS.

Bren wrote:

See, that's what was so puzzling. In those first few seconds when the BIOS is waking up and you have the option of hitting a function key, or in the case of this particular computer, the delete key, you'd think that at that point I would have been given the ability to select the CD/DVD as the boot disk. No such luck when the XP disk was in there, but when I started up with the Ubuntu disk, that step wasn't even necessary.

That really has more to do with underlying PC architecture than Windows per se. EFI should be along shortly.

Just in passing, I expect to use Linux sooner or later to get more life from components on hand since it does well on older, lower-spec hardware, and you really don't need bells and whistles for basic functions. It's especially good if you have some efficient stuff (I do) that minimizes your electric bill, in that van down by the river.

Linux really is well suited to older, lower power PCs, having played around with Ubuntu myself the only negative thing I can say about linux is no iTunes for Linux and when you ask people how to solve a problem youʻre having someone will inevitably give you a paragraph of Linux CLI commands to enter into the terminal, IMO linux wonʻt really catch on with the masses until the terminal is as little used as the terminal on my MacBook

I can't see how that would be a good thing.

dv wrote:

My feelings towards iTunes are mixed: it's a sluggish, monolithic, annoying program that still manages to do everything, and not crash much in the process.

I'll agree with you on that!

But on-topic... iTunes is the one application I really wish were available in Linux.   Anybody who owns an iPod or an iPhone is pretty much out-of-luck with Linux.     I personally run XP in VirtualBox on my Linux laptop, just so I can keep my iPod connected.

And yes, I know that Amarok and Rhythmbox and SongBird all claim to have iPod compatibility on Linux, but really it's a joke.

Bren wrote:

Why would you want to own an iPod or an iPhone?

because you don't want to be squirted by a zune owner...

Bren, do you know how to find this girl Nicky for me.  I want to meet her and see if she is for real.