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#1 2003-09-18 12:22 am
Boss Wants to Buy Computer
Let me preface this by saying that all bosses suck. It's America's greatest passtime to hate authority figures! We all bash the President. We all don't like things bosses do and say. It's our Constitutional RIGHT to rag on the boss! Just in case the boss reads this he can't fire me now!
I was talking to my boss before leaving work today. He is considering what new computer to buy (for home use) and he asked my for an opinion. He knows very well what computer I use. (iBook 600 w/ 10.2.6) He uses a Dell with XP. I said, point blank, "You KNOW what my answer is going to be already."
He said, "...But I don't want to have to worry about Macintosh being incompatible with Windows." My answer was, "I send you files and access the computer network all the time. We don't have any more trouble communicating than you do with other Windows users." (In fact, on the rare occasions when I DO have trouble it's usually the Windows user's fault!)
"But I don't want to have to change all my stuff to Macintosh", he says. 'XCUSE ME!! I have all the Macintosh stuff already on MY computer! I can use the network to get all the stuff you need onto your computer in MINUTES! Most things install by way of self-installing packages/installers.
"But I'll have trouble using the internet", is the next excuse.
Now THIS is the funniest one of all! The boss lives on campus. He has a 10/100 ethernet direct line coming into his HOUSE! (The campus has a T-1 feeding a gigabit fiber optic backbone.)
He's got all the network he can ever use. When I tell him that he can buy a new G4 iMac and have it out of the box and running on the network in less than 10 minutes he looks at me like I have three heads! I use my iBook on the network every single day. It works perfectly!
"Oh, I think I'll get another Dell like the one I have here." {Points to computer on office desk.}
I asked him, "Do you know that in order to use Windows XP you have to give Microsoft the right to look on your computer via the internet, to see what's on your computer and to make changes to your computer any time they want to? They don't even have to tell you that they are doing it? They can do it any time they want. If you try to stop them from doing it, your computer will just quit working!"
He acted like I was lying or something. I reached over to the computer on his desk and Googled up a web page. (Search Terms: Windows XP EULA) I clicked the "luck" button and got THIS page.
I got a look that was somewhere between, "I don't care." and, "You're making this all up."
How can people be so stinking incalcitrant?
Windows XP is such a galactically bad thing, yet people are sucking it up like a baby on the teat! It's actually mind-numbing!
Bosses suck!
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#2 2003-09-18 12:41 am
- Old Time Hockey
- The Iron League

- From: Kingdom of Loathing
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Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
Ask him to buy you a new Mac and show him how it's done, straight out of the box. Tell him to bring a stopwatch.
The story .... I'm still gasping ...
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#3 2003-09-18 12:45 am
- test
- Member
- From: Collingwood, Ont., CANADA
- Registered: 2002-12-13
- Posts: 5300
Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
Face it, the only way to piss a person off more than by proving they are wrong is to prove that they have been wrong for a very long time and were too dumb to realise it specifically because the proof was there all along.
Patience is a virtue of the weak for it makes them stand still long enough for the strong to crush them with ease.
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#4 2003-09-18 1:07 am
- sosumi
- numbery
- Royal Wombat

- From: North Mexico
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Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
A person who will make retarded excuses like that is one who is completely unwilling to change. If anything, you should refer him to the sheer assloads of virus problems that showed up this summer.
A co-worker of mine got a virus 2 days after getting his computer! Plugging in a little infected USB flash drive was all it took.
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#6 2003-09-18 1:49 am
- Denibriliny
- Banned
- Registered: 2001-05-07
- Posts: 878
Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
People who are too stubborn to give macs a chance, don't deserve a mac.
On the school playground, two kids in kindergarten were arguing about something, and one of them started crying. A teacher comes up to them and asks what is wrong. The kid who is crying points to the other kid and goes "he insulted my operating system!"
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#7 2003-09-18 1:55 am
- Drunken Penguin
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Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
Dude, you should tell him he can run XP on his mac too if he really wans to still be a Microshaft bitch!
"We are like monkeys, who are stupid." - me in that macmind video
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#8 2003-09-18 2:04 am
- HackerJax
- Previous Poster

- From: *unknown*
- Registered: 2002-07-13
- Posts: 4871
Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
I can understand and respect you wanting to talk the guy into buying a Mac but you didn't have to resort to outright bullsmurf to do it.
"Do you know that in order to use Windows XP you have to give Microsoft the right to look on your computer via the internet, to see what's on your computer and to make changes to your computer any time they want to? They don't even have to tell you that they are doing it? They can do it any time they want. If you try to stop them from doing it, your computer will just quit working!"
MS cannot shut down your computer remotely. They cannot auto-update your system without your permission. Windows XP isn't programmed to do that. The section of the EULA you are talking about is a legal "ass covering" for MS in the event that a user running "Auto Update" has a problem and tries to hold MS liable for it. They are basically saying "You agreed to let us update your software". Whether there are issues with that in and of itself is open for debate but MS cannot just randomly decide to screw with your installed copy of XP. They don't scour your documents folder or anything like that. It just dosen't work like that. You have to turn Auto-update on and even when its on all you get are critical updates automatically. If you opt out of it then MS has no way of knowing what you have on your system and there is nothing they can technically do to change that.
He acted like I was lying or something.
You were.
-=Jax=-

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#9 2003-09-18 6:33 am
- LCGuy
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- From: /dev/null
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- Posts: 3873
Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
All i can say is don't waste your time. People like that never change. Trust me, i've learnt that from experience.
"I mean how hard can it be?" - Jeremy Clarkson
Friends don't let friends buy ACER.
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#10 2003-09-18 9:56 am
- cocoamix
- Member

- Registered: 2001-03-01
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Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
How can people be so stinking incalcitrant?
Windows XP is such a galactically bad thing, yet people are sucking it up like a baby on the teat! It's actually mind-numbing!
Bosses suck!
Yes, that sucks. It can sometimes be a long road to conversion, but don't be too belligerent and approach it as someone who has his best interest at heart, and not someone with a personal agenda for wanting him to switch.
BTW, I think you mean "recalcitrant."
Jingoism - Extreme and emotional nationalism, or chauvinism, often characterized by an aggressive foreign policy, accompanied by an eagerness to wage war.
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#11 2003-09-18 10:18 am
- NAG
- A witch!
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Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
I am fine with idiots using Windows. That hopefully means fewer idiots on the forums.
jk
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#12 2003-09-18 12:04 pm
- mtpalms
- plz stand by

- From: Telstar
- Registered: 2002-09-16
- Posts: 4534
Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
My new Epson scanner came yesterday
When I opened the box, laying on top was a sheet of paper that said,
"WARNING! Windows XP Users!...." and it went on to say that they should install a particular patch before installing any drivers or software in the box.
Apparently this was very important to them, because there was a second warning in the baggie with the software and instructions. Noteworthy to me, but probably business as usual to PC Users.
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#13 2003-09-18 12:40 pm
- Marc
- On the run from the MPAA

- Registered: 2003-05-10
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Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
in that order
You know the hole, the one you put the pie in?
My mean my pie-hole?
Yeah, shut it.
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#14 2003-09-18 2:43 pm
Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
The first question I ask myself before recommending a Mac to anyone is "Would I like this person being part of the Mac community?" In this person's case, I'm sure my answer would have been no, so I would just nod my head and walk away whenever they make such uninformed and stupid PC vs. Mac remarks.
Captain Kirk: "Once again we've saved civilization as we know it."
Dr. McCoy: "And the good news is they're not going to prosecute."
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#15 2003-09-18 3:23 pm
- why8not9
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- From: Austin, TX
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Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
have him buy his cheap little PC...don't waste anymore time on him
if it works it works, if it doesn't? oh well...
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#16 2003-09-18 3:27 pm
Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
I can understand and respect you wanting to talk the guy into buying a Mac but you didn't have to resort to outright bullsmurf to do it.
I see your point. I was probably dramatizing the situation more than was called for. Still, whether it's CYA on Microsoft's part or not, you give them permission to do it. The End User's License Agreement (EULA) refers to a Purchaser's Use Rights (PUR) document which can be changed at any time.
I also understand that, in practice, Microsoft doesn't "analyze" your computer to see what's on it. Nor do they actively "shut down" your computer. You do have the right to deny the updates but, according to the agreement, they don't have to tell you what they are doing. If you continue to deny those updates you will lose the ability to view certain kinds of content or access certain features on your computer. This is not the same thing Apple does when they say, "iTunes 4.x is required to use the Music Store.", or, "OS 10.x is required to run this program". It's also different than Apple's provision of "Media Keys" (in QuickTime) which may require some sort of "password" to view, save or modify a QT movie, for example.
I may be guilty of oversimplifying and overdramatizing the problem but it is STILL a problem. The article I linked to describes it much better than I can.
Ask him to buy you a new Mac and show him how it's done, straight out of the box. Tell him to bring a stopwatch.
Y'Know... When I bought my first iMac (iMac DV/400) I did just that!
I started with the iMac in its sealed box. My brother started the stopwatch the moment I cut the tape on the box and paused it when the computer went, "Bong!" It took a little under 8 minutes, including hooking up the printer and external floppy drive. He restarted the watch again when I clicked the "Do you want to sign up for an internet account?" button and continued counting until the first web page loaded. (It was www.apple.com.) That took another 12 minutes. The watch was paused for, maybe 10 minutes while we celebrated with "high fives" and cheers of, "Dude! I got an iMac!" If you count the entire time of the experience, including celebration time, it was less than 30 minutes from slicing the tape to surfing the web! If you took the boss's situation where the internet is already up and running I guarantee that it will take 10-15 minutes from start to finish.
I'm not really THAT rabid about the Mac/PC thing all the time. It's just this particular circumstance where I made a suggestion, albeit a strong one, and the other person didn't even consider it. I even told him to simply check out Apple's website, Apple.com/Education, and he flatly refused.
What really amazes me is how "stuck" most people are in their thinking. It goes beyond the old "Footbal Team" analogy where people will debate the merrits of one team over another. Both parties implicitly realize that they are simply being loyal to their Home Team. If I was convinced that he was being loyal to what he knows I wouldn't be so bugged about it.
No! This is more along the lines of, "Eat Soylent Green!"
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#17 2003-09-18 4:22 pm
Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
have him buy his cheap little PC...don't waste anymore time on him
if it works it works, if it doesn't? oh well...
I agree. And while you're at it, recommend he request the computer come with Windows ME. 
Captain Kirk: "Once again we've saved civilization as we know it."
Dr. McCoy: "And the good news is they're not going to prosecute."
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#18 2003-09-18 5:01 pm
- Marc
- On the run from the MPAA

- Registered: 2003-05-10
- Posts: 13129
Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
Or Win 95. could you do that still? You cant can you?
You know the hole, the one you put the pie in?
My mean my pie-hole?
Yeah, shut it.
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#19 2003-09-18 7:25 pm
Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
Or Win 95. could you do that still? You cant can you?
An indy shop could do it, because they'd keep the POS in stock.
It'd be for lower generations of pentium, though. I don't think 95 will run with a P4 at the core.
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#20 2003-09-19 5:55 am
- LCGuy
- Member
- From: /dev/null
- Registered: 1999-03-06
- Posts: 3873
Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
have him buy his cheap little PC...don't waste anymore time on him
if it works it works, if it doesn't? oh well...I agree. And while you're at it, recommend he request the computer come with Windows ME.
NO! Windows 98 First Edition! And "forget" to install the USB drivers....
Btw, there is really no reason as to why 95 wouldn't run on a P4, as long as you have Windows 95 compatible versions of the drivers for the devices inside the computer (video chip, sound chip, NIC, motherboard, etc). Ever seen an 800 Mhz PIII run Windows 3.1? 
"I mean how hard can it be?" - Jeremy Clarkson
Friends don't let friends buy ACER.
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#21 2003-09-20 4:23 pm
- HackerJax
- Previous Poster

- From: *unknown*
- Registered: 2002-07-13
- Posts: 4871
Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
I see your point. I was probably dramatizing the situation more than was called for. Still, whether it's CYA on Microsoft's part or not, you give them permission to do it. The End User's License Agreement (EULA) refers to a Purchaser's Use Rights (PUR) document which can be changed at any time.
Yes. I'm surprised that EULAs have survived in their current states as long as they have. I mean you can write an EULA up so that someone agrees to it when they open a package, before they have even read it! There is just something wrong with that.
I also understand that, in practice, Microsoft doesn't "analyze" your computer to see what's on it. Nor do they actively "shut down" your computer. You do have the right to deny the updates but, according to the agreement, they don't have to tell you what they are doing.
Right. You have given them permission to update your system for you. How many people would really understand the technical jargon that accompanies many updates ?
If you continue to deny those updates you will lose the ability to view certain kinds of content or access certain features on your computer.
You won't loose the ability to view content. If you can already view it you have no problems. You might not be able to view newer content that an update makes the OS support but its not like suddenly one day jpegs won't work on your computer because you missed an update.
-=Jax=-

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#22 2003-09-20 4:33 pm
- locutus_of_borg
- Knight of Mars

- From: Sparkopolis
- Registered: 2002-07-31
- Posts: 1499
Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
Btw, there is really no reason as to why 95 wouldn't run on a P4, as long as you have Windows 95 compatible versions of the drivers for the devices inside the computer (video chip, sound chip, NIC, motherboard, etc). Ever seen an 800 Mhz PIII run Windows 3.1?
Win95 under a P4 would run into a lot of errors. Win3.1 under a 1.1Ghz Tbird divides zero often. If I can find my old copy I will load it onto my 3.5Ghz P4 ona an extra HD. 
And God said "taketh your rifles, all of ye, all but those unto the nation of California, for exempt must their rifles be and the resth are forlorn." So sayth the Lord.
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#23 2003-09-20 4:40 pm
- daviddennis
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- From: Woodland Hills, CA
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Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
Bosses can be cool. It all depends on the boss :-).
I think people should consider what you're saying a bit more seriously. What Microsoft says in the EULA is what they want to have in it. They are not doing the nasty things mentioned at present, but that's a powerful indication that they /want to/ and that in and of itself should send shivers down the spines of Windows users everywhere.
Their argument for doing those things is likely to be tied in with the presence of viruses and worms, so watch out. And by all means tell your boss that the virus and worm problem is probably the best argument for the Mac presently available.
D
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#24 2003-09-22 3:50 pm
Re: Boss Wants to Buy Computer
A person who will make retarded excuses like that is one who is completely unwilling to change
I think he was trying to be convinced and wanted to see if this guy could debunk all his excuses.
I'm going to slap your ass so hard, your bell-bottoms will be ringing.
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