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even stranger for catholics, since the pope considers this an unjust war. but american catholics only bother with the pope when they agree with him. (were it a just war, the catechism says it's okay and proper to support it.)

Last edited by grundel (2005-03-03 9:29 am)

scorio23 wrote:

I am a Roman Catholic, born and raised.  Every time I go to church, I see cars plastered with "Pray for our Troops" yellow ribbons.  When those same people begin to talk about the war, they are 100% in support of it, saying we are doing the right thing.  What I cannot really understand is why.

We go to church, listen to the priest, deacon, or parishioners, talk about loving your neighbor, altruism,  families, friendship, and kindness, then leave to talk about how going to war is doing the right thing.  Correct me if I am wrong, but wasn't Jesus a pacifist?  Didn't he encourage people to lead by their kind actions?  I just don't see the correlation between killing, and his teachings.  (granted, people have killed in his name for years)  The only reason I do not support the war is because I don't think that is something Jesus would approve of.  Yet the vast majority of people who share the same religion as I do, feel that this is what Jesus wants us to do.  I don't really want to get into is the war in Iraq justified or anything, but what I want to know is, how do people who follow the teachings of Jesus Christ fully support the war?

So if anybody could help this severely confused college student and clarify this, I would appreciate it.



::Justin

scorio23/Justin:

As a Roman Catholic I will provide my opinion, in the hopes that you profit from it.
Our Church parking lot, too, is emblazoned with vehicles sporting "Pray for our Troops" emblems, along with almost universal support for our President, George W. Bush, yet we pray for our holy father, Pope John Paul II, and the Vatican, in the name of Jesus Christ. The Vatican, as you acknowlege, has not supported the war.

You crystalize the argument as you suggest: "how do people who follow the teachings of Jesus Christ fully support the war?" To that I reply:

The War on Terror, for which the Iraq and Afghanistan fronts are but a part, were not of our choice. During the 1990s, this nation stood idly by while terrorism gained momentum. No real measures were taken to fight terrorism, until 09/11/01. That day brought terrorism to our doorsteps. In order to affect security, we responded to re-achieve some measure of security. Military efforts in Afghanistan and Iraq, as well as worldwide, were made to fight terror, free oppressed people, liberate communities, and assess a measure of freedom to folks that were suffering at the hands of those dictators and organizations that fueled terror or were terrorists themselves: Taliban, Al Qaeda, Bathist Party, others...

Many believe that Jesus Christ would approve of a nation that would honor its inner benevolence to help other nations, oppressed nations, such as Afghanistan and Iraq, and others, and liberate people so oppressed. Such help works to international advantage in achieving security, and works to liberate those oppressed by tyranical regimes. In so doing, particularly in Iraq, U.S. troops began to pay a price: a high price. Currently more than 1500 Americans have paid the ultimate price; thousand more are injured. Yet, the cause for which our soldiers are engaged, or military is engaged, is just. Democratic reform, within the larger goal of international security, is the mission.

Would Jesus Christ approve? I believe he would.

You will, no doubt, get conflicting opinion here on this board. Many liberals would disagree with what I just outlined. I'm sure many would violently disagree. They want the United States to remain a selfish nation, not engage in spreading democracy, and not fight against terror. Such actions may yield more acts of terror here on the homefront: more civilians dead.

I would suggest, scorio23/Justin, that you consult the majority of the soldiers that are fighting this war, what their thoughts are... most seem to support the mission. Many are Christian and many are Roman Catholic. Ask them.

Camp David

Government is the government. You are you. Follow your own rules and do what they tell you, obey your own rules about what's right and not.
Give the government what's from the government, give to others what comes out/from you(r) hearth.

As for the church, being god's house so to say, the people aren

Last edited by Proost (2005-03-03 10:55 am)

ShnickyShnack wrote:

Besides, according to the brand of protestant evangelicalism that's prevalent in today's America, Jesus wasn't a pacifist, and when he returns he'll be doing a whole bunch o' slaughtering.

You mean the anti-christ?

I see 2 divergent ways people use religion:
One is to study and learn and then modify your behavior to fit the beliefs laid out or..

Study the book to find justification for the way you already are and to do the things youd want to do regardless.

The latter discribes most "religious" people I know.

Proost wrote:

ShnickyShnack wrote:

Besides, according to the brand of protestant evangelicalism that's prevalent in today's America, Jesus wasn't a pacifist, and when he returns he'll be doing a whole bunch o' slaughtering.

You mean the anti-christ?

No, I mean the Christ.

obtuse wrote:

ShnickyShnack wrote:

Proost wrote:

You mean the anti-christ?

No, I mean the Christ.

IIRC, one of the signs of the antichrist is that he brings a great peace to the nations.

I'm referring to the evangelical stuff I've seen bandied around MiniThink, portraying Jesus as an ass-kicking vengeance demon sort of fellow.

Proost wrote:

So they can't read it anywhere but they think it nevertheless?

There is some biblical basis for the belief.  It involves mostly just using the non-Jesus parts of the new testament and ignoring or reconciling the actual words of Jesus in odd ways.

obtuse wrote:

ShnickyShnack wrote:

Proost wrote:

You mean the anti-christ?

No, I mean the Christ.

IIRC, one of the signs of the antichrist is that he brings a great peace to the nations.

So Kofi is the Anti-Christ?

obtuse wrote:

Cyberpawz wrote:

obtuse wrote:

IIRC, one of the signs of the antichrist is that he brings a great peace to the nations.

So Kofi is the Anti-Christ?

no

Well he keeps on trying to bring peace to all the nations... so why not?

Cyberpawz wrote:

obtuse wrote:

Cyberpawz wrote:

So Kofi is the Anti-Christ?

no

Well he keeps on trying to bring peace to all the nations... so why not?

there are a host of reasons why not.

I support the troops, but not the war.  A lot of righty-tighties can't seem to fathom the two being seperate.