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#1 2007-10-16 6:07 am
- mrreet2001
- Member

- From: NW Ohio
- Registered: 2005-05-25
- Posts: 4343
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screw flash I like my drives big and hard
http://apnews1.iwon.com/article/20071015/D8S9L7TO0.html
who ever says nand is the way to go. bleah I will take my 4T 
2.66Ghz QuadCore-Nehalem w/24"LED CD ---2.2Ghz BlackMB---15" 2.4Ghz MBP(work)
Dual 2.3Ghz G5 (4G Ram, 2x 250G HD)(10.5 server)--- 400Mhz G4 PM (10.4 Server)
1.5GHz Powerbook---1.6Ghz G5 iMac
"So he fels down in a poisoning gas."
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#2 2007-10-16 8:26 am
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
Couldn't read the article because of all those damn pop up ads.
"I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down.'"
-- Bob Newhart
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#3 2007-10-16 8:49 am
- mrreet2001
- Member

- From: NW Ohio
- Registered: 2005-05-25
- Posts: 4343
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Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
By MAY WONG
SAN JOSE, Calif. (AP) - Multimedia stockpilers need not worry about laptops, digital video recorders or portable music players hitting a storage capacity ceiling any time soon.
Hitachi Ltd. (HIT) (HIT) says its researchers have successfully shrunken a key component in hard drives to a nanoscale that will pave the way for quadrupling today's storage limits to 4 terabytes for desktop computers and 1 terabyte on laptops in 2011.
A terabyte can hold the text of roughly 1 million books, 250 hours of high-definition video, or a quarter million songs.
"It means the industry is making good progress to advance the capacity of disk drives and move to smaller form factors," said John Rydning, an analyst at market research firm IDC.
The feat, which Hitachi plans to present Monday at the Perpendicular Magnetic Recording Conference in Tokyo, revisits a technology known as giant magnetoresistance, or GMR, that was the basis of the work of two European scientists who won the Nobel Prize in physics last week.
A hard drive has a metal disk inside that spins as an arm with an electromagnetic head at its tip hovers over it. The head reads bits of data by registering the magnetic bearing of the particles on the disk.
Capacities of hard drives have grown as researchers have crammed more bits of data closer together while also making the heads sensitive enough to read the data. The industry looks to new technologies every time physical limitations kick in, and GMR - which allows for extremely thin layers of alternating metals to detect weak changes in magnetism - was one of the breakthroughs that led to the fastest growth rate in the early 2000s, allowing hard drives to double in capacity every year.
But GMR-based heads maxed out, and the industry replaced the technology in recent years with an entirely different kind of head. Yet researchers are predicting that technology will soon run into capacity problems, and now GMR is making a comeback as the next-generation successor.
"We changed the direction of the current and adjusted the materials to get good properties," said John Best, chief technologist for Hitachi's data-storage unit.
By doing so, Hitachi said it has created the world's smallest disk drive heads in the 30-nanometer to 50-nanometer range, or about 2,000 times smaller than the width of an average human hair.
Other hard drive companies are working on similar technology as well, Rydning said. He predicted the entire disk drive industry will begin migrating to this new type of GMR-based technology in 2009.
2.66Ghz QuadCore-Nehalem w/24"LED CD ---2.2Ghz BlackMB---15" 2.4Ghz MBP(work)
Dual 2.3Ghz G5 (4G Ram, 2x 250G HD)(10.5 server)--- 400Mhz G4 PM (10.4 Server)
1.5GHz Powerbook---1.6Ghz G5 iMac
"So he fels down in a poisoning gas."
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#4 2007-10-16 12:07 pm
- Random User
- One of those Internet guys
- From: Houston, TX
- Registered: 2002-06-17
- Posts: 1151
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
Gatchaman wrote:
Couldn't read the article because of all those damn pop up ads.
What popup ads?
I'm using Firefox on my Mac and I get no popup ads. Are you on an infected PC?
"Blu-ray is just a bag of hurt." - Steve Jobs
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#5 2007-10-16 12:17 pm
- Aqua OS X
- Shark Sandwich

- From: Oakland, CA
- Registered: 2000-06-05
- Posts: 12669
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
IMHO this is a non-story. Was anyone NOT expecting hard drives to be 3 to 4 times bigger in 5 years?
Sure, 4TB sounds impressive, but not by 2011. Hard drives -should- be hitting 4TB in 5 years.
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#6 2007-10-16 12:49 pm
- MyMac8MyPC
- Member
- Registered: 2007-10-09
- Posts: 192
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
Our Seagate drive is already using Perpendicular Recording, but it's nice to see that they are making advancements in other areas.
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#7 2007-10-16 2:08 pm
- pkmgarf
- Member
- From: Sussex, WI
- Registered: 2007-06-13
- Posts: 479
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
What, may I ask, are you going to put on a 4TB drive? A bunch of hi-def video I suppose...
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#8 2007-10-16 2:48 pm
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
pkmgarf wrote:
What, may I ask, are you going to put on a 4TB drive? A bunch of hi-def video I suppose...
lolcat photos, of course!
"I'd rather be told, 'Have a nice day.' by someone who doesn't mean it, than 'F*** you!' by someone who does." - Lewis Black
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#9 2007-10-16 2:56 pm
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
pkmgarf wrote:
What, may I ask, are you going to put on a 4TB drive? A bunch of hi-def video I suppose...
You know, people were asking that very question when five megabyte drives came to market, some twenty-five years back.
It was a stupid question then and, well… you fill in the rest.
,xtG
.tsooJ
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#11 2007-10-16 4:40 pm
- mrreet2001
- Member

- From: NW Ohio
- Registered: 2005-05-25
- Posts: 4343
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Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
pkmgarf wrote:
What, may I ask, are you going to put on a 4TB drive? A bunch of hi-def video I suppose...
OS Drive (programs and such): ~90GB
Main Data Drive:
-itunes library: 100 GB
-Photographs: 17 GB
-Misc imove docs: 11 GB
-Misc Documents: 99 GB
-Back up of all of the household appleTV rips: 43 GB
BU Drive:
Exact copy of every thing on data drive minus apple tv rips: ~230 GB
disk copies drive: 230 GB of misc install disks and exact copies of dvd
Cakejd Project Drive: 100 Gb of original SD video clips & MPEG2 encodes for 1 DVD
OS Bu drive 1: 100 GB of house hold OSX os back ups
OS Bu drive 2: ~90 GB an exact copy of my main os drive.
-----------------------
I am looking at 1.1 T of what I have.
This does not include:
50+ Back up CDs and 10+ back up DVDs that has data from pre 2001
Apple Logic Studio which will be installed within a month or so
a few apple jam packs
what ever Leopard will take up
+ my new Cannon Rebel xti @ 10 mega pixels (2.8 - 3 plus megs each) loves to chew up space.
Oh and my Mother has taken up drawing historical building and scanning and reproducing @ 13 by 19, scanned with no compression weigh in at 400 megs each)
2.66Ghz QuadCore-Nehalem w/24"LED CD ---2.2Ghz BlackMB---15" 2.4Ghz MBP(work)
Dual 2.3Ghz G5 (4G Ram, 2x 250G HD)(10.5 server)--- 400Mhz G4 PM (10.4 Server)
1.5GHz Powerbook---1.6Ghz G5 iMac
"So he fels down in a poisoning gas."
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#12 2007-10-16 5:17 pm
- pkmgarf
- Member
- From: Sussex, WI
- Registered: 2007-06-13
- Posts: 479
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
Maybe I should clarify...for the average user, 4TB is overkill. Even now, my 500gb drive is more than I will need. I consider myself to have a rather large music library at ~40gb, but that is not even 10% of my drive.
Most people don't do drive backups, though they should, but they don't. Granted, some people will fill 4TB, but unless file sizes increase or people start scanning eight foot by eight foot photos, it is overkill, in my opinion. However, I do realize that more and more people will be storing video digitally and doing DVR type stuff....so, when that takes off to the point that it is as mainstream as DVD's, drive requirements for the average user will change. My statement was meant to apply to how people use their stuff now....
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#13 2007-10-16 5:37 pm
- wellfleation
- High on Life

- From: Metheun, Mass.
- Registered: 2001-11-13
- Posts: 8684
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
ukimalefu wrote:
No, the answer is pr0n!
It always is... it always is.
FIGHT
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#14 2007-10-16 5:44 pm
- wellfleation
- High on Life

- From: Metheun, Mass.
- Registered: 2001-11-13
- Posts: 8684
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
I prefer to have my data backed up on a couple of drives as opposed to one big one as it is less likely that multiple drives will fail at the same time. I currently have a 250GB and a 320GB connected via AirDisk to my MacBook Pro (120GB HD) and also back-up to my PoweBooks 120GB external. So I got back-ups of my back-ups of my back-ups of my back-ups. I hope TimeMachine can handle everything.
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#15 2007-10-16 5:57 pm
- Pariah
- James Carville Fan..

- From: Belly Of The Beast, Oklahoma!
- Registered: 2001-05-24
- Posts: 18425
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
pkmgarf wrote:
Maybe I should clarify...for the average user, 4TB is overkill. Even now, my 500gb drive is more than I will need. I consider myself to have a rather large music library at ~40gb, but that is not even 10% of my drive.
Most people don't do drive backups, though they should, but they don't. Granted, some people will fill 4TB, but unless file sizes increase or people start scanning eight foot by eight foot photos, it is overkill, in my opinion. However, I do realize that more and more people will be storing video digitally and doing DVR type stuff....so, when that takes off to the point that it is as mainstream as DVD's, drive requirements for the average user will change. My statement was meant to apply to how people use their stuff now....





In 1997 I got a 6500 with a 2.1 gig hard drive, a 100% increase over the 1 gig drive my 6400 had. I wondered what on earth I would do with all that space.
10 years latter I have almost 500gigs of space and am running out of room.
"and it's not surprising that they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."
Barack Obama
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#16 2007-10-16 6:00 pm
- mrreet2001
- Member

- From: NW Ohio
- Registered: 2005-05-25
- Posts: 4343
- Website
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
pkmgarf wrote:
Maybe I should clarify...for the average user, 4TB is overkill.
no to the "average" user 40 gigs is over kill.
if a user has all of there music ripped then 200 gigs is over kill
however if a person does any real work such as photos, video, audio
4T would / will / is very handy
2.66Ghz QuadCore-Nehalem w/24"LED CD ---2.2Ghz BlackMB---15" 2.4Ghz MBP(work)
Dual 2.3Ghz G5 (4G Ram, 2x 250G HD)(10.5 server)--- 400Mhz G4 PM (10.4 Server)
1.5GHz Powerbook---1.6Ghz G5 iMac
"So he fels down in a poisoning gas."
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#17 2007-10-16 6:45 pm
- MyMac8MyPC
- Member
- Registered: 2007-10-09
- Posts: 192
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
pkmgarf wrote:
Most people don't do drive backups, though they should, but they don't.
Got something to back that up?
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#18 2007-10-16 7:24 pm
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
Random User wrote:
Gatchaman wrote:
Couldn't read the article because of all those damn pop up ads.
What popup ads?
I'm using Firefox on my Mac and I get no popup ads. Are you on an infected PC?
No, I'm using safari on a mac.
"I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down.'"
-- Bob Newhart
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#19 2007-10-16 11:22 pm
- Aqua OS X
- Shark Sandwich

- From: Oakland, CA
- Registered: 2000-06-05
- Posts: 12669
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
mrreet2001 wrote:
pkmgarf wrote:
Maybe I should clarify...for the average user, 4TB is overkill.
no to the "average" user 40 gigs is over kill.
if a user has all of there music ripped then 200 gigs is over kill
however if a person does any real work such as photos, video, audio
4T would / will / is very handy
And this claim is grounded in what?
More then enough people have several gigs of music and or photos. Moreover, now that people are making and buying movies online, disk space vanishes quickly.
And with the upcoming popularity of integrated version tracking and backup software, 40gigs is going to be crippling.
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#20 2007-10-17 12:00 am
- Pariah
- James Carville Fan..

- From: Belly Of The Beast, Oklahoma!
- Registered: 2001-05-24
- Posts: 18425
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
In invocation of this proverbial "average or typical" user has become quite tedious lately.
"and it's not surprising that they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."
Barack Obama
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#21 2007-10-17 12:37 am
- Aqua OS X
- Shark Sandwich

- From: Oakland, CA
- Registered: 2000-06-05
- Posts: 12669
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
I've come to learn that "average user" is really just code for "my parents."
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#22 2007-10-17 12:38 am
- Fried Chicken
- Member

- From: Good question - keeps changing
- Registered: 2003-11-17
- Posts: 4557
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
I could imagine myself filling 4TB. Whenever I have the feeling that I have unlimited data available to me, it quickly fills up.
Raw photos, full DVD rips of libraries, full DV video, etc. etc. etc.
It adds up quickly.


Just because something is legal, doesn't mean it's right. Just because something is illegal, doesn't mean it's wrong.
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#23 2007-10-17 12:43 am
- dv
- Negusa Negest
- Moderator

- From: Minneapolis, MN
- Registered: 1999-08-30
- Posts: 18100
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
I've got a 500 GB HD and an Airport Extreme with Airdisk in the mail.
I intend to have a computer in every room of my new apartment. There will be multimedia glory on the smurfing toilet, people.
"Now commences the process of cutting off the head, which generally takes from an hour to an hour and a half by an expert workman with a sharp blade." -Reuben Delano, Wanderings and Adventures
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#24 2007-10-17 3:23 am
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
pkmgarf wrote:
Maybe I should clarify...for the average user, 4TB is overkill. Even now, my 500gb drive is more than I will need. I consider myself to have a rather large music library at ~40gb, but that is not even 10% of my drive.
Most people don't do drive backups, though they should, but they don't. Granted, some people will fill 4TB, but unless file sizes increase or people start scanning eight foot by eight foot photos, it is overkill, in my opinion. However, I do realize that more and more people will be storing video digitally and doing DVR type stuff....so, when that takes off to the point that it is as mainstream as DVD's, drive requirements for the average user will change. My statement was meant to apply to how people use their stuff now....
It's still a silly statement.
That five megabyte drive I mentioned? Yes, it was overkill for the "average" user, back in the early eighties. But there were users that filled it at the tip of a hat, too, and some of them could easily justify paying for it.
A few years later, five megabytes was tight for the "average" user, but the latest and greatest forty megabyte drives were the new overkill.
The largest available drives will always be overkill for the "average" user. But things change, and before long, those capacities will be middle of the road, or even the low end.
Bear in mind that storage capacities aren't the only things that change. Computer processing capacity continues to increase, as does I/O throughput. So not only will people be storing more data, their hardware will be able to process more data, too. That makes it more likely that ever larger data files will be used. I remember a time when my computer strained for minutes to display an 800x600 GIF image in 256 colours. Nowadays, I can flip through hundreds of them in a matter of seconds.
Today, I would guess your "average" user has, what, three to five years' worth of digital photos archived? But look at grandma's lifetime collection of photographs stored in shoeboxes in the attic. Imagine that amount stored digitally. Imagine computers powerful enough to process such amounts of data, and that four terabyte drive is starting to make sense. Bear in mind that digital cameras are being equipped with ever larger (at least in pixel count) sensors, too.
,xtG
.tsooJ
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#25 2007-10-17 3:29 am
- Aqua OS X
- Shark Sandwich

- From: Oakland, CA
- Registered: 2000-06-05
- Posts: 12669
Re: screw flash I like my drives big and hard
I don't have a hard drive. My OS, apps, and files exist on a series of 3.5 in. double density floppies.
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