Forums | MacLife

user wrote:

"cost benefit ratio"?

Winning the war but losing your moral values?

Nice trade-off.

Morality is a hard thing to find in this war.

I do find that you think that "saving lives" is an immoral act as for being most odd...

Yeah, no thanks.

iThinkIam wrote:

I do find that you think that "saving lives" is an immoral act as for being most odd...

Not really. Isnt that the excuse used for the vast majority of immoral actions?

Lets "save Germany!" cried the Nazis. Lets "save the white race!" shouted the KKK. Lets "save unborn babies!" screamed the clinic bombers. Lets "save  ourselves!" exclaimed the Hale bop comet people. Let's "save Islam!" said the suicide bomber. Lets "save Isreal" as they lobbed mortars into residential areas of Palestine. etc etc etc

Yeah, most odd indeed!

iThinkIam wrote:

user wrote:

"cost benefit ratio"?

Winning the war but losing your moral values?

Nice trade-off.

Morality is a hard thing to find in this war.

I do find that you think that "saving lives" is an immoral act as for being most odd...

Let’s say you’ve caught a suspect and you’re sure he’s a terrorist, and you’re sure there’s a nuclear bomb somewhere in Manhattan, and you’re sure he knows where it is, and you’re sure this particular terrorist has been trained to resist torture just long enough that you could never get the true location of the bomb out of him in time. But you’re also sure this particular terrorist is a pervert! And he tells you that if you’ll rape your own child in front of him, he’ll tell you exactly where the bomb is and how to disarm it. And you’re sure that he will, because your intelligence is that good in exactly that way.

source

Would you do it?

iThinkIam wrote:

So you'd rather the CIA go all nice on terrorists during questioning, and you'd rather that intel not be acted enabling more terrorists to commit atrocities or remain free and at large?

Oh I get it....if I don't support illegal acts of torture such as waterboarding, then obviously I'd "rather the CIA go all nice on terrorists." Because it's certainly one or the other.

I think your moral compass is broken.

But that doesn't really mean a lot coming from you, does it?

iThinkIam wrote:

So, the CIA is evil and the terrorists are the good moral agents?

I don't follow your logic.

Who has the CIA killed, or do you disagree with the benefits of the intel?

What's with the strawmen?  Are you unable to form a persuasive argument with resorting to such nonsense?

bratboy wrote:

iThinkIam wrote:

So you'd rather the CIA go all nice on terrorists during questioning, and you'd rather that intel not be acted enabling more terrorists to commit atrocities or remain free and at large?

Oh I get it....if I don't support illegal acts of torture such as waterboarding, then obviously I'd "rather the CIA go all nice on terrorists." Because it's certainly one or the other.

I think your moral compass is broken.

But that doesn't really mean a lot coming from you, does it?

You are still not addressing the results.  Denial of the facts and results while claiming to hold some empty moral high ground is pointless.

Last edited by iThinkIam (2007-12-11 12:26 pm)

Since we are torturing terrorists, let's get the child molesters too. Protect the kids, right? Murderers are next. We do want to know where the bodies are at. You know, I bet we could stop bad driving if we waterboarded everyone caught running a red light.

IthinkIam, you go ahead and sacrifice your freedom for a little security.

Me? I am not a coward. Proper, Constitutional interrogations work. I would rather take the inconveniences of freedom than all of the pleasures of a police state.

Jdude

iThinkIam wrote:

You are still not addressing the results.  Denial of the facts and results while claiming to hold some empty moral high ground is pointless.

Not addressing the "results" how?  I haven't denied anything.  Are "results" good?  Sure.  Does that mean we should go to whatever lengths possible to obtain "results," including torture? 

Not in my opinion.

Just hope no one ever takes it in his mind that YOU deserve some waterboarding.

Think that could never happen? Once the restraints are removed, what's to stop it?

iThinkIam wrote:

StaticAge wrote:

iThinkIam wrote:

So, the CIA is evil and the terrorists are the good moral agents?

I don't follow your logic.

Who has the CIA killed, or do you disagree with the benefits of the intel?

Did I make any of those claims? I dont follow your logic.

It's simple, did water boarding cause more HARM, or more GOOD?

I thought we were talking morality?

If I steal a rich man's money, it might not mean all that much to him, but the money might mean huge benefits to me- does that make it right since it brought me more GOOD than it brought him HARM?

Last edited by StaticAge (2007-12-11 12:31 pm)

bratboy wrote:

iThinkIam wrote:

So, the CIA is evil and the terrorists are the good moral agents?

I don't follow your logic.

Who has the CIA killed, or do you disagree with the benefits of the intel?

What's with the strawmen?  Are you unable to form a persuasive argument with resorting to such nonsense?

I think the argument is not mine, and its rather clear.  Let me try to simply it for your "legal" mind.

Has water boarding killed anyone?

Have the results of these questioning techniques saved any lives?