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#26 2007-12-20 7:10 pm

iThinkIam
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Registered: 2007-03-19
Posts: 409

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

actually your post just gave me an idea...  and I like it.


A new view option to stacks could be, yes, Cover Flow.

It'd work just like Grid, but with a little cover flow action, and hey, even a scroll bar.  Even cooler, it could cycle based on where you hover over it, or with your mouse enabling click-gestures like on the iPhone.  Seeing as touchscreen Macs seem inevitable, I think this idea will come around eventually. 

The other idea I had was "Wheel," which would be either a vertical or horizontal ellipse which would scroll with your scroll wheel [sorta like Events in iPhoto].

::runs to patent office::

Last edited by iThinkIam (2007-12-20 7:11 pm)


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#27 2007-12-20 7:43 pm

Mr. T
Best of both worlds
From: omnipresent
Registered: 2002-04-02
Posts: 4223

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

Ha, nice try jackass.  I'm not biting...

And furthermore, if you have any intention of reaching your 400th post, it'll be a good idea to cease being a complete ass - and not just to me.. I've noticed a pattern of behavior with you.  I'd be very surprised if you actually had any friends in real life; cuz your personality ain't all that appealing..

Last edited by Mr. T (2007-12-20 7:45 pm)


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#28 2007-12-20 7:54 pm

iThinkIam
Banned
Registered: 2007-03-19
Posts: 409

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

Mr. T wrote:

Ha, nice try jackass.  I'm not biting...

And furthermore, if you have any intention of reaching your 400th post, it'll be a good idea to cease being a complete ass - and not just to me.. I've noticed a pattern of behavior with you.  I'd be very surprised if you actually had any friends in real life; cuz your personality ain't all that appealing..

That's true, I should try to be more classy and calm like you.  I really don't think you speculating on my life in the real world based on my posts makes much sense, but then I'm not the one whose really making an ass of myself.

Try to stay on topic, lest someone as classy as yourself comes along and asks you to stop trolling.

Last edited by iThinkIam (2007-12-20 7:54 pm)


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#29 2007-12-20 7:55 pm

Czachorski
Member
Registered: 2002-12-20
Posts: 5584

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

Mr. T - stop trolling.

wink


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#30 2007-12-20 8:01 pm

iThinkIam
Banned
Registered: 2007-03-19
Posts: 409

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

Seriously, COVER FLOW IN STACKS.

I guess I'm just a Stacks FANBOI. lol


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#31 2007-12-20 8:01 pm

Mr. T
Best of both worlds
From: omnipresent
Registered: 2002-04-02
Posts: 4223

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

Gee, thanks Zac...  wink   smile

Last edited by Mr. T (2007-12-20 8:02 pm)


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#32 2007-12-20 10:58 pm

Jasoco
Your own personal Jesus
From: Doylestown, PA, USA, Earth
Registered: 2000-08-26
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Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

Wake me up when they return Spotlight to its former Tiger usefulness.

For the love of GOD, Apple. Please return Spotlight to its TIGER state!


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#33 2007-12-20 11:45 pm

matt
a very bad matt
Registered: 1999-09-16
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Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

iThinkIam wrote:

Mr. T wrote:

Pariah wrote:

So back where we started. :goth:
A shame they couldn't do something useful like make them spring loaded.

Well they are, in the "usual" way.  Dragging a folder onto the current iteration of docked "folder" will indeed provoke a Finder window to spring open.  In tiger, you'd get nothing.

This is what stacks should've been:

(1) There needs to be a clear distinction between "docked folders" and "stacks"

     (a) A stack should be thought of as a pile of icons.  Stacks are created by selecting a bunch of icons in the Finder and dragging the selection to the dock.  A stack should support the same four views I define below for docked folders (b1, b2, b3, b4).

     (b) A docked folder should remain just that - a folder.  Clicking on the folder should present the contents of the folder in one of four (user-defined) views:

          (b1) Hierarchal menu - similar to Tiger, but customizable.  You should be able to sort the menu by name/date/etc.  You should also be able to drag items "through" the menu hierarchy (they can make this black for consistency).
          (b2) Hierarchal icon - similar to the current Grid view, but hierarchal.  In addition, there should be a vertical scroll bar when the items don't all fit.  The user should be able to change the icon size as well.  Like the menu view, this view should support dragging/navigating through the hierarchy. 
          (b3) Hierarchal List - Just like list view in Finder (but black for consistency).  Again, a scroll bar should appear as needed, and this view should support dragging/navigating through the hierarchy.
          (b4) Hierarchal Fan View - Fan view looks cool, so let's make it better by making it hierarchal.  As with the other views, this should support dragging/navigating through the hierarchy, user-defined icon size, and scrolling.  As a final touch, the "Show in Finder" button should always appear at the bottom.

All of these views should be spring loaded!!!  Getting a Finder window is certainly an improvement, but I'd rather get a stack view (as I've defined it).

Yeah, you do know that b1,2, & 3 , and 4 for that matter can be achieved by a radical user action called a double click, right?

more or less...


Being loud: The next best thing to being right.

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#34 2007-12-21 12:36 am

maleko
Member
From: Eugene, OR
Registered: 2006-11-25
Posts: 1221

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

Jasoco wrote:

Wake me up when they return Spotlight to its former Tiger usefulness.

For the love of GOD, Apple. Please return Spotlight to its TIGER state!

Spotlight was useless in Tiger too.

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#35 2007-12-21 12:54 am

bratboy
laden with emotion
Royal Wombat
From: Austin, Texas
Registered: 2003-01-19
Posts: 34106

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

matt wrote:

more or less...

What gave it away?


"One thing we've learned is there's a difference between being disappointed and having madmen in authority."

                                                                   --Paul Krugman

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#36 2007-12-21 1:39 am

Mr. T
Best of both worlds
From: omnipresent
Registered: 2002-04-02
Posts: 4223

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

matt wrote:

more or less...

I might've lost the forest for the trees.  We're actually saying the same thing, believe it or not...

Short Version
I agree with what you wrote earlier about how stacks and dock folders should work (with the addition of spring-loaded menus).  But we should also have legacy support for proponents of the current behavior.  I'd also like to improve this behavior with the addition of icon resizing, scrolling and navigation (we have the latter two in menu view).


Long Version

My definition of a "stack" is exactly what you proposed earlier as a "real" stack.  So I know we agree on that - it was your idea!!!

matt wrote:

Oh, and if Apple would add real Stacks(meaning a bunch of files/folders from different locations dropped into the dock and represented by one dock icon), that wold be a plus.

My "hierarchal menu" view is exactly what you proposed earlier with one added feature: the ability to drag items through the hierarchy.  Think "spring-loaded menu" instead of "spring-loaded Finder window."  If you like springs, then we agree on this as well.

matt wrote:

I think those of us who hated Stacks would be content with the old menu system and added spring-loadedness(?).

So I know we at least agree on (1), (a), (b), and (b1).

That leaves icon view, list view, and fan view.  Well you know what?  I agree with you that these are useless.  So why did I bother mentioning them?  Because icon view (aka Grid View) and fan view are already there, and some people like them.  So why should I kill off features that some people like, so long as I don't have to use them?  Isn't that why we're here?-- Apple killed off a feature we liked.

Given that, do you think a person who likes grid and fan view would like my changes to these views? (I'm really asking).  Please be specific.   Note that all I'm really adding to these views is icon resizing, scrolling, and navigation (the latter two, we already have in menu view).

Really, the only part of my post that's coming from left field is the "hierarchal list" view.  I threw this in for the sake of completion.  We have a menu view and an icon view, why not a list view?  I'll leave this question open:  Would anybody find this useful?

Last edited by Mr. T (2007-12-21 1:43 am)


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#37 2007-12-21 2:20 am

rufio
Let the funeral start, hear the casket close...
From: texas/ohio
Registered: 2003-10-26
Posts: 2261

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

matt wrote:

Oh, and if Apple would add real Stacks(meaning a bunch of files/folders from different locations dropped into the dock and represented by one dock icon), that wold be a plus.

Dammit you are so right.

I thought that would be a cool feature, be able to add my last-modified projects from 5 different folders and put them in a stack on my dock to get to them easily, no hierarchal menu system or double clicking involved.

But I guess Apple had a different interpretation of what a "stack" is than I did when I heard it was going to be a feature.

Apple seems to translate every new requested feature to be EYE CANDY!

We want a redesigned finder? Cover flow eye candy!
We want some dock improvements? Let's make it look cooler!
Could we improve the menubar? Maybe, but let's just make it look better!
iMovie needs updated.... We should redesign it with a better interface at the expense of some features, no one will mind...


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everything is second after first."
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#38 2007-12-21 2:36 am

Mr. T
Best of both worlds
From: omnipresent
Registered: 2002-04-02
Posts: 4223

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

rufio wrote:

I thought that would be a cool feature, be able to add my last-modified projects from 5 different folders and put them in a stack on my dock to get to them easily, no hierarchal menu system or double clicking involved.

Apple demoed an early version of stacks that worked that way.  Your thoughts were justified. The way stacks were supposed to be.


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#39 2007-12-21 11:48 am

oatmeal
the clueless ones
Royal Wombat
Registered: 2002-08-07
Posts: 609
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Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

Sweet jumping Jehosophat!

http://images.macrumors.com/article/2007/12/20/stackslistview1_300.jpg

That's EXACTLY the way I hoped it would work.

The option to display either the folder image or the jumble of icons?  Yet ALSO have the ability to make the folder-looking thing work either as a hierarchal menu OR as a stack or grid (which is useful for folders with few items)?

Thanks, Apple.  I couldn't have asked for a better solution.  up

... just don't change your mind on this before releasing it.  eek

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#40 2007-12-21 1:01 pm

Blandford Fly
Member
From: Malformed People Factory
Registered: 2003-04-04
Posts: 2142

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

Stacks?   Is that in Tiger?   Where is that?


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#41 2007-12-21 1:12 pm

wellfleation
High on Life
From: Metheun, Mass.
Registered: 2001-11-13
Posts: 8678

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

Mr. T wrote:

rufio wrote:

I thought that would be a cool feature, be able to add my last-modified projects from 5 different folders and put them in a stack on my dock to get to them easily, no hierarchal menu system or double clicking involved.

Apple demoed an early version of stacks that worked that way.  Your thoughts were justified. The way stacks were supposed to be.

That was SUCH A BETTER implementation it's criminal! How hard would it be to get that back?


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#42 2007-12-21 3:17 pm

bratboy
laden with emotion
Royal Wombat
From: Austin, Texas
Registered: 2003-01-19
Posts: 34106

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

Mr. T wrote:

Apple demoed an early version of stacks that worked that way.  Your thoughts were justified. The way stacks were supposed to be.

Wow, 'Stacks' is a much more appropriate name for that function.  That would be useful, I wonder why they got rid of it.


"One thing we've learned is there's a difference between being disappointed and having madmen in authority."

                                                                   --Paul Krugman

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#43 2007-12-21 4:30 pm

Pariah
James Carville Fan..
From: Belly Of The Beast, Oklahoma!
Registered: 2001-05-24
Posts: 18402

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

bratboy wrote:

Mr. T wrote:

Apple demoed an early version of stacks that worked that way.  Your thoughts were justified. The way stacks were supposed to be.

Wow, 'Stacks' is a much more appropriate name for that function.  That would be useful, I wonder why they got rid of it.

My suspicion would be because it would take more than one sentence to explain how it worked.


"and it's not surprising that they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."
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#44 2007-12-21 5:00 pm

ScifiterX
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From: NW Palm Bay, Florida
Registered: 2000-02-10
Posts: 18088
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Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

I also suspect there was an issue when it came to using it for dynamic content like folders. Notice they didn't ever just drag a folder into the stack. It was always documents or applications in any of the old demonstrations.

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#45 2007-12-21 5:06 pm

ScifiterX
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From: NW Palm Bay, Florida
Registered: 2000-02-10
Posts: 18088
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Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

Best would have probably been if they kept the old Stacks system and complemented it with the 10.5.2 version of the new one.

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#46 2007-12-21 5:21 pm

Mr. T
Best of both worlds
From: omnipresent
Registered: 2002-04-02
Posts: 4223

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

http://homepage.mac.com/oatmeal/MAF/maxes/slapmax.gif

Yes, exactly!  That's pretty much what I was trying to say before, except the message got lost in a pile of jargon.


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#47 2007-12-21 11:48 pm

reece_james
TheLAD
From: Wollongong, Australia.
Registered: 2001-12-01
Posts: 3790
Website

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

Jasoco wrote:

Wake me up when they return Spotlight to its former Tiger usefulness.

For the love of GOD, Apple. Please return Spotlight to its TIGER state!

Tiger: Spotlight's interface was nice, but it wouldn't find everything.
Leopard: Spotlight's interface is an abomination, but it does find everything.

What needs to be fixed.
• When I want to search in a Finder window, I expect it to default to searching from that folder. Not the entire computer.
• An easy way of ordering results. (Size, kind etc.)
• A search such as ari .app saf should find Safari as the top hit.
• The same search in the Spotlight menu and the Finder should return the same results.


Reece [/IMHO]
"All posts on the internet are postfixed by an invisible 'IMHO'", tito
Intel iMac CD 1.83Ghz, 2GB RAM, 17" + 20", 1160GB HD, 10.5.2.
MacBook CD 1.83Ghz, 2GB RAM, 60GB HD, 10.5.2.

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#48 2007-12-22 12:11 am

rufio
Let the funeral start, hear the casket close...
From: texas/ohio
Registered: 2003-10-26
Posts: 2261

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

Mr. T wrote:

rufio wrote:

I thought that would be a cool feature, be able to add my last-modified projects from 5 different folders and put them in a stack on my dock to get to them easily, no hierarchal menu system or double clicking involved.

Apple demoed an early version of stacks that worked that way.  Your thoughts were justified. The way stacks were supposed to be.

Thanks for that link. I'm glad I know I am not a crack head and that's what the idea of a "stack" is supposed to be. Hah.

For the time being, I will continue to use my dock for a little as possible, hide it over on the left side, and wait for some piece of shareware to allow this original stacks idea to be implemented, hopefully in Tiger too so I don't have to upgrade.

My leopard disk has been sitting at home collecting dust until I can find a viable reason to upgrade my main machine. It practically put my Mac Mini out of commission, so it's hard to judge when to make the OS jump. I don't remember upgrading to Tiger until 10.4.3, but I do remember getting a copy of Panther right when it came out, that was a HUGE OS upgrade experience-wise.


"Outside of this forum
everything is second after first."
       -pcguy

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#49 2007-12-22 12:19 am

ScifiterX
婚約中
Moderator
From: NW Palm Bay, Florida
Registered: 2000-02-10
Posts: 18088
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Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

Mr. T wrote:

http://homepage.mac.com/oatmeal/MAF/maxes/slapmax.gif

Yes, exactly!  That's pretty much what I was trying to say before, except the message got lost in a pile of jargon.

You gotta be careful. Occam's Razor cuts deep when you forget it.

Oooh, good one! ::Adds to Sig::

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#50 2007-12-22 2:56 am

oatmeal
the clueless ones
Royal Wombat
Registered: 2002-08-07
Posts: 609
Website

Re: Stacks Haters Rejoice!

reece_james wrote:

• A search such as ari .app saf should find Safari as the top hit.

confused

Why would you ever conduct such a search?  I'm not saying that your other points aren't spot-on, but this one just baffles me.

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