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I just did the archive and install and it worked just fine, keeping everything in its place exactly as it should. For what it's worth, I found a few things "out of place" that you may wish to fix for yourself:

-- The favorites folder didn't make it into the sidebar in Panther's finder. Find it in your library and drag it to the sidebar if that's where you want it.

-- If you have an old beta install of apple's X11, the old application is still in your applications folder. Don't spend three hours trying to get that to work when the new one is in the utilities folder.

There were probably a few other things, but make sure that when all is said and done and you think you have everything out of your old system that you want, you throw out the "Previous Systems" folder to save space.

yeah, i'm kinda curious about this too.  does the archive and install save everything and put it all back later?  why?  why wouldn't you just do a normal install, then?  what does it do differently?

Czachorski wrote:

Some people are really frowning on the upgrade option, saying that it is bad to install a new OS over an old one. Is that true? Does it result in a less stable install?

I think I've heard something about that in the past... However, I've always done the upgrade option (because it comes up by default). I did that when going from 10.1 to 10.2 and I just did the same thing last night when going from 10.2 to 10.3. I haven't had any stability problems with Jag in the past and Panther seems just as stable and wonderfully awesome as ever. (Seriously Panther is so cool! It feels like a truly gooey GUI... he he he)  Expos

I would rather install one time. That said, I am going to backup everything twice, erase the HD and install a clean system. This way I can almost guarantee there won't be issues...you can too.

just did archive and install on 3 machines.  Here's my impressions of what happens:

applications folder stays in place while anything new within gets updated as needed while old versions of APPLE apps are moved to a new apps folder within "previous systems"

home folder (and other users) remains intact while anything that needs it is upgraded and older stuff is moved to "previous systems"

library and system folders are replaced completely.  old versions moved to "previous systems"

why this is all important:
"application support" is in the library.  This can break some applications.  for instance, I needed to reinstall quicken after the update.  it wouldn't launch at all, hard crashes across the board.

anything you keep in the library is moved to "previous systems".  this includes anything in the webserver folder.  I learned this the hard way.  I lost my local copy of my site and had to redownload the whole thing.  not a total loss, but i wish i had realized this ahead of time.

Long and short:  don't delete your previous systems folder until you are absolutely sure you've gotten everything you need back out of it.

lateralis

I would rather install one time. That said, I am going to backup everything twice, erase the HD and install a clean system. This way I can almost guarantee there won't be issues...you can too.

I keep Mac OS X on one partition and home folders on another partition. My home folder has a folder inside called Applications(Custom), where I keep all of the applications I have installed.

I just boot from the CD, wipe the OS X partition, install the new version of OS X, clear any preferences starting with com.apple, and point OS X back at my home folder.

Clean Install in place.

yes, I must say, as a first impression, I don't think I'll be doing archive and install again.  I can see where it would be great for some things but if you are a "pro" user, ie, one who has customized your system (with or without the terminal) in some non-basic ways, this option can really screw you up.

also, On furthur checking, application support for most stuff seems to have stayed in place.  so quicken might have been a different story.  possibly something in the system folder?  basically without a solid breakdown of what exactly happens to everything, I'm gonna just upgrade from now on.

lateralis

Hmm, I'm glad to see I'm not the only one pondering what to do about this
situation.  I've got the same doubts and second thoughts, but MY solution is to continue waiting until it's clear what the best method is for the average user (like me). 

I'm also a bit scoffy about the "come-on, jump in, the Aqua's fine!" slant of Apple's own posted "solutions."  They make it sound as if there's no danger at all, that there's no need to "save" anything but your email and internet settings.  They DO advise checking to see that your peripheral devices are compatible (all of mine are), but only say that we should check with 3rd party developers for their software compatibility -- omitting the possibility that the 10.3 install might take away those same 3rd party apps.

So I'm gonna sit back and relax, petting my Jaguar for a while longer. Maybe by the time 10.3.8 comes out...?
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If you don't have time to do it right the first time, when are you going to
have time to do it over?

Hey,

If I were to wipe my hard drive to do a clean install of Panther, what does that mean for Classic support? Do I have to install OS 9 on my HD first and then do Panther, or what's the deal here?

Thanks a lot,

CzechMate

Thanks for the come back.  I think your story is terrific, I love it when that happens! 

I got into Macs in '99, thanks to a buddy who's got 20 years experience installing / servicing both Mac and PC corporate networks, etc.  He gave me a 15 year-old Mac SE, so I could use it to write short stories and novels.  I went NUTS!   About 7 months later, I spied a 7 year old Mac LCIII at a yard sale.  I went MORE nuts!  I'd never guessed the things I was missing by not having a computer. 

Naturally, I ended up buying an iMac (Dec., 2000).  From there it's been easily definable as an addiction, hence my presence here. 

But, I've never been to CompUSA (south of A2).  My big thrill came last winter when I visited the then-new Apple Store in Novi.   Talk about:   

I resisted tempation until this past August, when I jumped to the eMac to get started on OS X.  Life for Mac Users: It just keeps getting better and better, eh?

Your story does prompt me to ask the age old question: Why don't more people catch on to Macs?  I know of a couple other examples like yours (or mine), but most friends and family I've urged just shrug their shoulders and go buy a "more affordable" Windows box.  Then they come to ME, asking how to do this and that on a system I know nothing about!  Or... their box goes down with a virus. 


Anway -- good luck with Panther and I meant it when I said "we" would like to know how it went.  (I'm just hangin' back, I'll definitely plunge eventually.)

I just created a disc image of my whole Mac OS hard drive using carbon copy cloner.  What a great program.  Anyway, I now have absolutely everything backed up in a disc image on one of my other hard drives.  That makes me feel a lot better about upgrading, no matter which option I go with, I know that I will NOT lose any data whatsoever.  I even launched a few apps from the disc image, and they launch with no problem.  It is kind of weird, actually, working with an exact copy of my system HD, I kind of feel like I am hanging out with it's twin and feel guilty.   

I will definetly keep you posted.  Anxious now for Panther to arrive.  I ordered it in thursday.  Hope it gets here soon. 

=======================================
That does sound like a great idea.  I think I'll try that myself; I'm currently backing up only 8 Gigs of eMac files, mostly JPEGs, TIFFS and PSDs, plus a few "important" docs -- all on the old 10 Gig HD I salvaged from my iMac DV after I put in a new 60 Gig IBM drive.  I put the 10 Gig in a FiWi enclosure  bought from Other World Computing.  I archive using Stuffit Deluxe, but it's time consuming.  But I'd need at least 18 Gigs to back up everything.

Now I can justify getting another 60 Gig IBM drive for that FiWi enclosure.


The iMac is only a 400 Mhz G3, 512 MB RAM, so I didn't think I ever wanted to install OS X. Only installed 9.1 so I might sell it on eBay.  It was at 9.2.2, but then the eMac deal came along and I decided to just "buy the whole package" which included 10.2.6.  and leave the iMac behind.  (Tho I loved that machine, 30 months of flawless operation!)

I just BET you're anxious for Panther to move in!  I'm eager too, but decided that Apple's had  a "bad month" with upgrades and will wait a while before puting 10.3 in the eMac. 

And  PS -- don't feel too wierd about having a clone around. For a while I had the iMac and eMac connected and they were "sleeping together."  It was then I realized that computers don't think about incest like we do. Hee-hee.

Czechmate -

If you were to erase your hard drive, classic would need to be reinstalled probably by first installing OS 9 and then putting OS X over top of that, or perhaps you would be able to get away with tossing 9 onto a different partition after X was installed, to keep them truly separate. I can't remember if that's what I did, but I have classic and X on different partitions now. You do actually need to reinstall from a 9 CD to get things to work, as 9 isn't a part of the OS X install anymore, nor is it even included in the box. Actually, if I remember, 9 never WAS a default part of X. It has to go on separate if you want it.

I do know you can select which classic system you want to use in the classic pane, though, so maybe it would work as a separate install.