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#1 2003-01-26 5:47 pm

quiksilver
Member
From: Saskatchewan, Canada
Registered: 2003-01-03
Posts: 4
Website

Self Employment or Job Hunt?

Hi,
    I am a student in Multimedia, third course, I was just wondering, with the great invention of the Internet and such, it makes it really somewhat easier to find a job.  I just want to know if self employment is the way to go?  Where I live, Saskatchewan, it is encouraged to work for yourself and stay here rather than move to another province or state.  As much as I don't want to move, the thought of making money is most pleasing as it is with everyone.  Anyhow, my friend and I put up a website for ourselves, we haven't promoted it yet much, we just are wondering if it's worth it to put all our blood, sweat, and tears into this self employment thing or to spend that time and money on trying to get a job with some company.  Any help would be much appreciated.
Sincerely,
Kerry


"It is far better to be the man, than to work for the man."

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#2 2003-01-26 6:02 pm

double time
Member
Registered: 2003-01-26
Posts: 546

Re: Self Employment or Job Hunt?

Not to burst your bubble, but it is estimated that for every web or graphic design related job posting at monster.com, over 300 people submit resumes.  A local company put an add in the paper for "entry level" web graphics and 50 people applied in person even though it was posted as paying $10, and the job went to a guy who's over 40 years and has 15 years experience.   I met a guy who made a low budget film and for actors he placed a tiny ad in the hollywood paper- in one week he had 800 resumes and headshots despite the job paying peanuts.

It's a really really bad time to try to get your foot in the door right now in  multimedia.  I took a night course for video editing for fun and it was full of out of work designers who lost their jobs due to the .com failures even though most had 5+ years full time experience.  Established design companies are constantly being underbid by capable yet starving programmers, artists, and webmasters. 

I'm saying this from the perspective of living in Los Angeles- and if media jobs are dying here, I can't imagine it being better anywhere else.

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#3 2003-01-26 7:13 pm

NAG
A witch!
Royal Wombat
From: /usr/local/apps/nag
Registered: 2000-09-22
Posts: 30229

Re: Self Employment or Job Hunt?

I wouldn't be self employed at first unless you got a lot of cash.

Also, can you please stick the web address in the "WebSite" field and not the "Location" field. It really screws up formatting.


"You call *this* archaeology?" • Professor Henry Jones
http://homepage.mac.com/dpauw/.Pictures/misc/moron.gif

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#4 2003-01-26 7:25 pm

pottymouth
Uncreative
Moderator
From: JP, MA
Registered: 2002-02-06
Posts: 17412
Website

Re: Self Employment or Job Hunt?

I was making $10/hr doing graphics at a small print shop for a year after I got out of school. I was sick of the place but couldn't find anything else. Eventually I went to a temp agency and they found me 40 hrs of work every week for 4 months entry level $18/hr. I had benefits and everything. Eventually one of the companies I temped at asked me to stay. Now I call that same agency to get all the temp help I need.

In other words, check out your loocal temp options. Most will even give you further education if you stay with em for a little while.

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#5 2003-01-26 11:12 pm

Gipetto
Yankee Doodle's noodle
Royal Wombat
From: People! Ahg!!
Registered: 2000-09-24
Posts: 9941
Website

Re: Self Employment or Job Hunt?

I was making $10/hr doing graphics at a small print shop for a year after I got out of school. I was sick of the place but couldn't find anything else. Eventually I went to a temp agency and they found me 40 hrs of work every week for 4 months entry level $18/hr. I had benefits and everything. Eventually one of the companies I temped at asked me to stay. Now I call that same agency to get all the temp help I need.

In other words, check out your loocal temp options. Most will even give you further education if you stay with em for a little while.

We just had a graphics temp agency drop out of our city (Denver) - it's pretty bleak here for just about everything "creative"

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#6 2003-01-26 11:29 pm

Twisted Guy
President of the Galactic Confederacy
Registered: 1999-03-28
Posts: 15984
Website

Re: Self Employment or Job Hunt?

We just had a graphics temp agency drop out of our city (Denver) - it's pretty bleak here for just about everything "creative"

That's about how it is here (Boise, ID area), as well.  I don't have much trouble getting by being self-employed, but I mostly end up doing self-promotional work, work for the local government (as icky as it may sound, it's pretty stable and pays well), and work outside of the state or even outside of the country.

I also apply to temp jobs/agencies, as well as with design companies or companies needing a designer on staff to supplement my contractual self-employment work.

I think it is wise to not pigeonhole yourself into one specific method of employment, but rather to just go where the flow takes you so you can find the most satisfying and appealing (and hopefully the most well-paying) jobs.


All hail Xenu!
http://imagegen.last.fm/EtherealForest/artists/5/TwistedGuy.gif

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#7 2003-01-27 12:20 am

double time
Member
Registered: 2003-01-26
Posts: 546

Re: Self Employment or Job Hunt?

We just had a graphics temp agency drop out of our city (Denver) - it's pretty bleak here for just about everything "creative"

no offense, but Boise isn't exactly the creative hub of the universe- I can't imagine the local businesses are dying to build a fresh identity.  But it is yet another example of how many trillions of creative people are finding that it takes more than a few classes and a sweet geocities homepage to earn a living.

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#8 2003-01-27 1:03 am

Twisted Guy
President of the Galactic Confederacy
Registered: 1999-03-28
Posts: 15984
Website

Re: Self Employment or Job Hunt?

We just had a graphics temp agency drop out of our city (Denver) - it's pretty bleak here for just about everything "creative"

no offense, but Boise isn't exactly the creative hub of the universe- I can't imagine the local businesses are dying to build a fresh identity.  But it is yet another example of how many trillions of creative people are finding that it takes more than a few classes and a sweet geocities homepage to earn a living.

You're a damn genius.  Reply to my post with a quote from the post preceding it.  I tip my hat in the direction of your brilliance.

You've obviously never been to the Boise area, nor are you even remotely familiar with it, because the high-tech, media, and creative industries are rather large and productive here, but finding "new" work in the field can be difficult because a lot of newer business are pulling out for economic reasons (and I can't blame them), and the larger businesses are very well established, and not so much in need of the help.  I never said, nor even implied that it was the creative hub of the universe; you're putting words into my mouth.  I was simply commenting on the state of the creative industry as I see it.  One of the largest commercial screen-printing and design companies in the entire northwest is located in the area, and I spent about a year with them before moving on to be self-employed.

The creative industry, whether it be design, multimedia, or whatever, is difficult to break into simply because of the large number of established companies and individuals, as well as the amount of experience necessary to be taken seriously.  Having a fresh and/or unique outlook, appearance, and style always helps get your foot in the door, but there is no substitute for experience and knowledge when trying to wrangle clients.

I spent a few years working at a few design and print shops before I struck out on my own.  To be frank, I'm not making as much money being self-employed as I was with a 40+ hour/week job, but I'm enjoying it more, which is a fair enough trade-off for me.  The time I spent working from the "bottom rung" of the industry (on the line as a printer at the aforementioned screen-printing outfit) on up through the production process all the way to design was experience I wouldn't trade for anything else.  It gave me a familiarity and intimacy with the final step in the process, which has really paid off doing freelance work.

So, to the original poster, I suggest starting yourself off somewhere at the end of the production line in your field so that you can get a knowledge of and familiarity with the final product, so as to not make the mistakes us artist/designer types tend to make during those first steps.


All hail Xenu!
http://imagegen.last.fm/EtherealForest/artists/5/TwistedGuy.gif

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#9 2003-01-27 1:07 am

NAG
A witch!
Royal Wombat
From: /usr/local/apps/nag
Registered: 2000-09-22
Posts: 30229

Re: Self Employment or Job Hunt?

I like the Boise area to some extent. It is better than Spokane. roll

I like the downtown area there but I have yet to find a good pizzeria.

Anyway, why is this turning into a personal attack? He was just describing the job availability of his area?


"You call *this* archaeology?" • Professor Henry Jones
http://homepage.mac.com/dpauw/.Pictures/misc/moron.gif

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#10 2003-01-27 1:20 am

Twisted Guy
President of the Galactic Confederacy
Registered: 1999-03-28
Posts: 15984
Website

Re: Self Employment or Job Hunt?

I like the Boise area to some extent. It is better than Spokane. roll

I like the downtown area there but I have yet to find a good pizzeria.

Anyway, why is this turning into a personal attack? He was just describing the job availability of his area?

There's no such thing as a good pizzeria in Boise.  The closest you'll get are some of the national chains (which mostly suck), or Idaho Pizza, which is alright, but not super good.  Mexican and Oriental restaurants are a whole other matter, and we have some great one's 'round here.  There's also a great local seafood restaurant in downtown Boise which I go to on occasion.  Anyways...

When it comes to creative work, you need style and talent.  Without those, you're not likely to find any work except as an art director or art teacher.  tongue  (no offense to those art directors and art teachers out there; I've met many of both professions who are especially talented, I just felt like propogating the classic stereotype a little)


All hail Xenu!
http://imagegen.last.fm/EtherealForest/artists/5/TwistedGuy.gif

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#11 2003-01-27 1:39 am

double time
Member
Registered: 2003-01-26
Posts: 546

Re: Self Employment or Job Hunt?


You've obviously never been to the Boise area, nor are you even remotely familiar with it, because the high-tech, media, and creative industries are rather large and productive here...

I live in Los Angeles, where 50% of US imports and exports pass through at a rate of $1 billion+ a day.  Los Angeles county has nearly 10,000,000 people while Boise has a population of 185,000.  California has the 5th largest economy in the world...  so get angry at me and take it all personal for pointing out that Idaho is barely on the map in all aspects except for how many potatoes you have.   I mention my experiences because California is a good indicator of the overall US economy, considering its revenue is 50% greater than New York, and twice that of texas- not to make an angry Mac user from Idaho suffer from penis envy.

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#12 2003-01-27 2:05 am

Twisted Guy
President of the Galactic Confederacy
Registered: 1999-03-28
Posts: 15984
Website

Re: Self Employment or Job Hunt?

Economic factors do not determine whether or not a particular location is a hub for creativity.  I never said Boise was the economic epicenter of the world, nor a thriving metropolis; it's quite far from either, but the high-tech, media, and creative industries are only rivaled by the agriculture industry here.  Heck, you might just have some RAM from Crucial in your computer, which is made by Micron, a company based here (my friend, who worked within aeronautics a little, even worked directly for the company's CEO, in the classic airplane building and restoring projects he undertakes on the side of his dutues as Micron CEO).  But, you obviously have an agenda and are trying to prove something or make up for some inadequacy, so look at yourself in the mirror before you start throwing the "penis envy" argument at me.

In terms of creativity, I find that a level of detachment from the hubbub and mess of ordinary society is a great benefit (well, at least, it seemed to work for many of the great creative minds in the past; especially Hemmingway who particularly enjoyed residing in Idaho).  I like having a quiet place where I can be introspective and self-reflective and away from the chaos and commercialization rampant in big cities.  I think true creativity and art (if that's where we're going here) can be found more easily when things are slow and easy enough for you to concern yourself with whether or not your ideas satisfy you and make you happy, rather than worrying so much about whether or not they will sell in a sea of filth from an over-indulged and over-stimulated society of jaded snobs.  Though the commercial creative industry is different, the same philosophies apply nonetheless, but with the availability of the internet, other high-speed telecommunications, and other technologies, does it really matter where someone lives as long as the final product reaches its destination?

But I digress...


All hail Xenu!
http://imagegen.last.fm/EtherealForest/artists/5/TwistedGuy.gif

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#13 2003-01-27 2:10 am

titok16
Sssssss
From: 1-314-237-0485
Registered: 2001-05-08
Posts: 10925
Website

Re: Self Employment or Job Hunt?

headbOX!!!
GAGHAHAHAHAHAHGHAGHAGHGHAGHAGHAGHGAHAGHGAHGAHG
OMG
GHAGHAGHGAHAGHGAHGAHGAHAGHGAHGAHAGHAGHGA
athat is sooooooooooo funny!!!!
gahahgahghaghaghgahghgahg
holy smurf!!! HEADBOX IS TRYING TO TALK POLITICS!!!!!!
5th biggest economy?? AHAHAHGHGAHAGHAGHGAHAGHGHGGAHAG OMFG, they are billions in debt because illegal immigrants are bleeding them dry!!! OMFL!!! THATS FUNNY!!!! nice job gov davis
ANd, you tRIED to say that CALIFORNIA ISNT freaking WIERD? that california is a US STANDARD?? FOR THE ECONOMY??? GHAHGHAHGAGH
GHAHAGHGAHGAHGHGAHGHGHAGAHHGAAGHAGHGHGA
gAHGAGHAGHAGHAGHAGHGHGHAHGHGHGHGAG
tito


shut up tito.
PICES
indeed.

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