Forums | MacLife

JakeTheTall wrote:

I don't understand why people lump Germany into the "anti-freedom, not helping in Iraq crowd"...but ignore Canada.

Afghanistan.

Its just refreshing to see a self-labeled Christian (Mr. Resedit) look down on a country (Germany) for being pacifist.

Sassy wrote:

Mexican people would probably love it, Canadians not so much, if at all.

I seriously doubt that if this was run as a referendum if it would pass in Mexico.  They're still not very happy that the US invaded them and stole 1/3 of their country.  Just because a bunch of rural peasants have left their country in the last two decades does not support your lame theory.

bedstuy wrote:

Sassy wrote:

Mexican people would probably love it, Canadians not so much, if at all.

I seriously doubt that if this was run as a referendum if it would pass in Mexico.  They're still not very happy that the US invaded them and stole 1/3 of their country.  Just because a bunch of rural peasants have left their country in the last two decades does not support your lame theory.

What poll numbers do you offer in support of your opinionated generalization?

I live in an area where the Hispanic population is 51%. People here are not demonstrating about the illegals having a 'right' to become citizens just because they now live in the USA. Hispanics do very well here. Many are native Americans and have little sympathy for the illegals, and most of them voted for the President. If you watch the 'death rolls' from Iraq, you will see that many of those listed are from Texas and have Hispanic names.

From my observation during visits to Mexico, the majority of people are very poor and barely eke out a living let alone a decent one. The government seems impotent to do anything constructive to alleviate the poverty. Things perked up during the early 80s, but the population keeps growing. There are no decent paying jobs there even after NAFTA, which was supposed to improve the economy. It's a very difficult situation for young people. They are the ones leaving, work here and send money back home to their families. That money accounts for more economic income than exports.

Don't know where you get your information, but it doesn't track with documentaries I've seen.

Sassy wrote:

bedstuy wrote:

Sassy wrote:

Mexican people would probably love it, Canadians not so much, if at all.

I seriously doubt that if this was run as a referendum if it would pass in Mexico.  They're still not very happy that the US invaded them and stole 1/3 of their country.  Just because a bunch of rural peasants have left their country in the last two decades does not support your lame theory.

What poll numbers do you offer in support of your opinionated generalization?

I live in an area where the Hispanic population is 51%. People here are not demonstrating about the illegals having a 'right' to become citizens just because they now live in the USA. Hispanics do very well here. Many are native Americans and have little sympathy for the illegals, and most of them voted for the President. If you watch the 'death rolls' from Iraq, you will see that many of those listed are from Texas and have Hispanic names.

From my observation during visits to Mexico, the majority of people are very poor and barely eke out a living let alone a decent one. The government seems impotent to do anything constructive to alleviate the poverty. Things perked up during the early 80s, but the population keeps growing. There are no decent paying jobs there even after NAFTA, which was supposed to improve the economy. It's a very difficult situation for young people. They are the ones leaving, work here and send money back home to their families. That money accounts for more economic income than exports.

Don't know where you get your information, but it doesn't track with documentaries I've seen.

I'll take two years of a Mexican boyfriend and knowing his many friends over your Mexican vacations for $5.  Otherwise your subsequent blather has nothing to do with the point I was making.  Your attempt to claim that a majority of Mexicans would wish to dissolve their nation and be subservient to a foreign power is quite weak at best.  In fact, I'd go further and say it's incredibly laughable.

Sassy wrote:

Back to Mexico, its problems and what can be done about it. I saw an interview on CSPAN -- can't remember who it was, but am sure he was hawking a book -- wherein his solution was that the only way the USA could protect itself successfully was to work toward a consolidation of the the north American continent. IOW, Canada and Mexico would become a part of the United States of North America. One country, one government.

I think that's exactly what we ought to do, myself.

Zapata wrote:

Pariah wrote:

bedstuy wrote:

I seriously doubt that if this was run as a referendum if it would pass in Mexico.  They're still not very happy that the US invaded them and stole 1/3 of their country.  Just because a bunch of rural peasants have left their country in the last two decades does not support your lame theory.

Stole, ha.
They were too lame to keep it.

You try and maintain control of a large amount of territories after recovering from a foreign invasion and occupation (by France).  I really don't think might makes right...  However what has happened, happened.

meh, cry me a river, the whole of the Americas where invaded, stolen and sacked. Nobody has a clean record and everyone was grabbing what ever they could get. When its 2 gangs of imperialists fighting no one occupies the high ground. The USA was stronger so we won.
Thats just the way it was. The rules of the game then were you got to keep what you could hold.

bedstuy wrote:

Pariah wrote:

The USA was stronger so we won.

Actually it's more accurate to say Native Americans had little to no immunity response to smallpox.

I have no idea how that relates to Mexico losing territory it stole from the Indians.

I understand that you disagree with her, but you act as if she claimed to form such an opinion on a spring break trip to Cancun.

bedstuy wrote:

Pariah wrote:

bedstuy wrote:

Actually it's more accurate to say Native Americans had little to no immunity response to smallpox.

I have no idea how that relates to Mexico losing territory it stole from the Indians.

ah yes... my bad.  I wasn't clearly reading your entire post!  heee [oops]

at any rate I stand by my statement that these sentiments are still prevalent in Mexico regardless of whether or not we find them ligitimate.  In fact, your average American gives the entire episode little thought whereas it's been my experience it still looms large in the Mexican psyche.  That's was my initial point.  Further subsequent American "interventions" during the next century all over the Western hemisphere merely reinforced this. 

I still find it amusing that anyone would think that a majority of Mexicans would vote to dissolve their own nation to be absorbed by the US.  Even funnier that they'd base this opinion on several vacation experiences!

Oh, yeah, I know the Mexicans have this whole oppressed++++ mythology built up about all that and that’s what’s behind the more radical elements of La Raza and MECHA.
Mexico has allot of parallels to us here in the USA, right down to a lot of almost cartoonishly blustery patriotism and a collection of Hispanic supremacist groups just like there are white supremacists here.
Thus the MEChA slogan: "Por La Raza todo. Fuera de La Raza nada" (Everything for the Race - Nothing outside the Race)

Last edited by Pariah (2006-04-21 1:10 pm)

bedstuy wrote:

No I do not... where have I said that?  You don't absorb that much about another culture until you've lived there or had some other form of contact over an extended period of time.  Even more so I would wager when you have an American interacting with a 3rd world country.

Sure, I agree with that.  I would think that significant exposure to the indigenous folk would be beneficial (something many do not experience with "vacations" to Mexico).  Based on her accounts of other experiences it wasn't clear to me that she had received such significant exposure.

I'd never claim to base an opinion of Italy based on my short jaunt to Florence in 1987 or my sexual liason with the Italian Roman Catholic priest in 1998 who requested I urinate on him.

Oh my...

bedstuy wrote:

bratboy wrote:

I understand that you disagree with her, but you act as if she claimed to form such an opinion on a spring break trip to Cancun.

No I do not... where have I said that?  You don't absorb that much about another culture until you've lived there or had some other form of contact over an extended period of time.  Even more so I would wager when you have an American interacting with a 3rd world country.

I'd never claim to base an opinion of Italy based on my short jaunt to Florence in 1987 or my sexual liason with the Italian Roman Catholic priest in 1998 who requested I urinate on him.

No, I haven't lived in Mexico, but have friends who did -- in Guadalajara for 15 years until a medical problem brought them back to California. Yes, I have vacationed there over the years.

We have owned real estate here in Corpus Christi for 20 years and as I mentioned earlier, Corpus is 51% Hispanic -- or did you miss that? Interaction is daily. I respect the Hispanic people here. They are kind, jovial, love children and hard working. My biggest problem with Texas is the absolutely poorest educational system they have. Gov. Bush did not, in my view, help that situation. It was no more effective than the current, No Child Left Behind debacle -- but that's another thread.

However, I do think I've met your criteria for "You don't absorb that much about another culture until you've lived there or had some other form of contact over an extended period of time." But, that isn't the point, anyway.

The point in my post is the idea put forth that the United States of North America is a possible solution to address border control and the threat of terrorism. It's an idea I've not heard before. I thought it worthy of consideration if not discussion.