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#1 2007-01-12 10:03 pm

thugmoni
Member
From: San Ramon, CA USA
Registered: 2001-05-09
Posts: 1845

Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

Link

Interesting.

thugmoni


Intel iMac / 10.4.8 (at home)
G5 1.6 / 10.3.8 (work)
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#2 2007-01-12 10:06 pm

after-life
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Registered: 2003-12-25
Posts: 2370

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

Hopefully this will close up some security flaws.

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#3 2007-01-12 10:20 pm

macnuke
just a plano guy
Moderator
From: North Dallas 40
Registered: 2004-05-16
Posts: 7132

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

MS just wants to sell more Word licenses.

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#4 2007-01-12 10:30 pm

mo' ron
PS3 4 EVA
From: NC, USA
Registered: 2002-10-15
Posts: 14245

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

I view my email in plain text anyway... email doesn't need all that crap. I raise my glass to MS on this one.


What is the difference between Vista and OSX?
- Microsoft employees are excited about OSX.

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#5 2007-01-12 11:49 pm

MattElmore
Member
From: Tuscaloosa, AL
Registered: 2003-02-28
Posts: 1778
Website

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

HTML has no place in email

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#6 2007-01-13 12:02 am

ephemeron
Member
Registered: 2003-06-23
Posts: 226

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

I'm not a particular fan of HTML email either, but the thing that jumps out at me here is that Word contains its own HTML rendering engine.  That just seems unnecessarily inefficient.

(Of course, my first Mac had a hard drive just barely big enough to hold the current version of Word -- the application only, none of the other files -- so I've been finding Word unnecessarily inefficient since version 6.0.)

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#7 2007-01-13 12:05 am

HackerJax
Previous Poster
From: *unknown*
Registered: 2002-07-13
Posts: 4871

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

I'm running outlook 2007 and I can't say that I've noticed a single difference in how HTML emails show when I read them.

I don't have IE 7 installed, still 6 but I don't think this makes a difference in how outlook  runs.


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#8 2007-01-13 4:07 am

mjsmitho
Integrated Graphics Banana
From: (-/;) NoPantsville, Texas
Registered: 2000-09-25
Posts: 5930
Website

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

I wish Microsoft would take email back 6 years and release Outlook for Mac OS again . . .

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#9 2007-01-13 6:29 am

avkills
demyelinated brain matter
Registered: 2001-05-09
Posts: 7094

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

Good.  Email with images and other fluff in them pisses me off. HTML in email is a total waste of bandwidth.

-mark

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#10 2007-01-13 6:30 am

reece_james
TheLAD
From: Wollongong, Australia.
Registered: 2001-12-01
Posts: 3790
Website

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

I wish MS went back 30 years and stayed there.

This is an interesting move and actually a good one. I'm starting to appreciate plain text more and more. Especially until email and web pages are redesigned for the next 50 years...


Reece [/IMHO]
"All posts on the internet are postfixed by an invisible 'IMHO'", tito
Intel iMac CD 1.83Ghz, 2GB RAM, 17" + 20", 1160GB HD, 10.5.2.
MacBook CD 1.83Ghz, 2GB RAM, 60GB HD, 10.5.2.

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#11 2007-01-13 6:46 am

mahakali
anti-razor
From: easter egg
Registered: 2002-11-06
Posts: 5584

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

reece_james wrote:

I wish MS went back 30 years and stayed there.

This is an interesting move and actually a good one. I'm starting to appreciate plain text more and more. Especially until email and web pages are redesigned for the next 50 years...

Though I prefer plain text, this move is like emptying your house to prevent thieves. There's no harm in allowing styles, the harm is when the email has embedded files like gif attachments, css file, or something that's on a remote server and can be used to track down whether the email address is valid or when/if the recipient open the email.

An email client should give users a choice to display html or not, not forcing them to read in html or plain text.


1. Instill fear.
2. ???????? (use your imagination)
3. Profit!

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#12 2007-01-13 8:19 am

Northwind
Member
From: Dallas, Tx, USA
Registered: 2000-10-31
Posts: 2696
Website

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

"HTML has no place in email."

"I like plain text anyway."

"In my day, you crawled 18 miles through snow and broken glass to get your mail, and you LIKED it!"


Christ, you people need an enema.


Reality has a liberal bias.

Real men wear kilts.

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#13 2007-01-13 8:28 am

Shadowless
Cpl, USMC
From: Jacksonville, NC
Registered: 2005-10-10
Posts: 3061

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

Though I find that most HTML or otherwise wastefully large e-mails are junk mail, it makes the file no smaller when it is sent or recieved just because it DISPLAYS it in a strange way.

There's no reason to prevent something from showing up, afaik. And I suppose that most e-mail apps allow you to view everything you get in plain text, right? I've never tried it, but I think my friend does that and he says it works well for him.


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#14 2007-01-13 10:07 am

test
Member
From: Collingwood, Ont., CANADA
Registered: 2002-12-13
Posts: 5300

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

Northwind wrote:

"HTML has no place in email."

"I like plain text anyway."

"In my day, you crawled 18 miles through snow and broken glass to get your mail, and you LIKED it!"


Christ, you people need an enema.

Not me - I use Metamucil. Works great.

And mail is still my favourite email client.


Patience is a virtue of the weak for it makes them stand still long enough for the strong to crush them with ease.

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#15 2007-01-13 10:35 am

Shadowless
Cpl, USMC
From: Jacksonville, NC
Registered: 2005-10-10
Posts: 3061

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

test wrote:

:snip:
And mail is still my favourite email client.

lol are we surprised?


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#16 2007-01-13 10:56 am

mo' ron
PS3 4 EVA
From: NC, USA
Registered: 2002-10-15
Posts: 14245

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

ephemeron wrote:

I'm not a particular fan of HTML email either, but the thing that jumps out at me here is that Word contains its own HTML rendering engine.  That just seems unnecessarily inefficient.

(Of course, my first Mac had a hard drive just barely big enough to hold the current version of Word -- the application only, none of the other files -- so I've been finding Word unnecessarily inefficient since version 6.0.)

Word has had an HTML engine for a while, the Mac version too.


What is the difference between Vista and OSX?
- Microsoft employees are excited about OSX.

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#17 2007-01-13 11:20 am

Avari
Member
From: Philadelphia, PA
Registered: 2003-11-21
Posts: 575
Website

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

People still use outlook and IE for that matter?

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#18 2007-01-13 11:35 am

mtpalms
plz stand by
From: Telstar
Registered: 2002-09-16
Posts: 4534

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

Avari wrote:

People still use outlook and IE for that matter?

At work. I'm at my boss's mercy.

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#19 2007-01-13 12:22 pm

Donkey Butter
jerk face
From: over yonder
Registered: 2005-12-14
Posts: 2444

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

I like html in emails.   why wouldn't ms just disable html as a default and then if you wanted to view it you could turn it on.  chances are most windows users would leave it the way ms defaulted it anyway.

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#20 2007-01-13 12:27 pm

ScifiterX
婚約中
Moderator
From: NW Palm Bay, Florida
Registered: 2000-02-10
Posts: 18088
Website

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

Indeed

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#21 2007-01-13 2:02 pm

HackerJax
Previous Poster
From: *unknown*
Registered: 2002-07-13
Posts: 4871

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

Donkey Butter wrote:

I like html in emails.   why wouldn't ms just disable html as a default and then if you wanted to view it you could turn it on.  chances are most windows users would leave it the way ms defaulted it anyway.

Yeah I don't get it, they basically do this now anyway.

in outlook 2007 by default images etc. will not show up in an HTML email until you specifically allow it.


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#22 2007-01-13 3:39 pm

ScifiterX
婚約中
Moderator
From: NW Palm Bay, Florida
Registered: 2000-02-10
Posts: 18088
Website

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

Then I definitely feel they are going in the wrong direction then. Ideally a company should increase or maintain potential user capability and convenience while being maintaining security. If a user then does something to loosen their security for the sake of convenience it's their responsibility. Being upfront and honest in what certain changes entail in terms of convenience and security only helps matters.
For instance

[ ] Text: Decreases the risk of being compromised by malicious emails but may cause incompatibles in how certain types of emails are displayed and handled
[ ] HTML: Increases the risk of being compromised by malicious emails but  displays and handles certain types of emails more effectively

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#23 2007-01-13 10:51 pm

reece_james
TheLAD
From: Wollongong, Australia.
Registered: 2001-12-01
Posts: 3790
Website

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

HTML, Flash, email all suck. Really, really, really suck. They were never designed for the current makeup of the web and are going to have to be replaced/updated in the future. I'll be betting on google making the move towards a better web.


Reece [/IMHO]
"All posts on the internet are postfixed by an invisible 'IMHO'", tito
Intel iMac CD 1.83Ghz, 2GB RAM, 17" + 20", 1160GB HD, 10.5.2.
MacBook CD 1.83Ghz, 2GB RAM, 60GB HD, 10.5.2.

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#24 2007-01-14 11:18 am

ballistik
Member
Registered: 2006-06-01
Posts: 29

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

lol!! Microsoft goes backwards, Apple goes forwards... sounds like Bill Gates wants to be where Apple was in the late 80's/early to mid 90's. That's fine by me!!

Outlook has ALWAYS sucked, and it will continue to suck big hard cold eggs.

Geeks and microshaft fans will come up with something like "its more secure" and we'll just laugh in their faces while we browse rich html email on our iphones, won't we? ;-)

-B

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#25 2007-01-14 12:31 pm

dv
Negusa Negest
Moderator
From: Minneapolis, MN
Registered: 1999-08-30
Posts: 18087

Re: Microsoft Takes Email back 5 years

ScifiterX wrote:

Then I definitely feel they are going in the wrong direction then. Ideally a company should increase or maintain potential user capability and convenience while being maintaining security. If a user then does something to loosen their security for the sake of convenience it's their responsibility. Being upfront and honest in what certain changes entail in terms of convenience and security only helps matters.
For instance

[ ] Text: Decreases the risk of being compromised by malicious emails but may cause incompatibles in how certain types of emails are displayed and handled
[ ] HTML: Increases the risk of being compromised by malicious emails but  displays and handles certain types of emails more effectively

Bah - plain text email is plenty consistent, except for stupid word wrap behavior. We could have had a standard behavior in place 20 years ago, but somebody dropped that ball.

HTML just makes it look prettier. It's certainly no more consistent.

I personally think Wordpad/TextEdit should be used as email rendering engines. Italics/bold and the odd picture or two is nice. If you want people to see your web site, email them a url.


"Now commences the process of cutting off the head, which generally takes from an hour to an hour and a half by an expert workman with a sharp blade." -Reuben Delano, Wanderings and Adventures

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